Question about game planning

[dronon]

Hi everyone,

Back last summer I started toying around with the idea of making an adventure game, and like a lot of other people, it was a project that got placed on the back burner.  I made my GUI, and then when I started trying to do the pixel art of my main character and animate him walking, that's when I gave up, because I'm a terrible artist and no animator.  I know that hasn't stopped other people, but still.

What I'm wondering is: If I made my own game using my limited artistic abilities, is it possible to replace everything (including walkable areas) in the game later with better imported graphics?  Or is it better to finish a rough game, then re-build it from scratch with a new set of graphics?  Would it be obnoxious to show up on the boards a year down the road and say "Hi, I've finished making a game, would anyone like to do all the art for it?"  'Cause the last thing I want to do is piss people off, assuming I ever go forward with this.

[vertigoaddict]

Well, you can always ask a person to do the art for you from the begining. (post in the recruitment thread in Adventure related talk)


But if you want to make the game first, i think it's okay there aren't any rules saying you couldn't make a game with crappy graphics then ask a person to re do and fix all of it...but I think you should just ask at the begining.

Then again there's the crittics lounge where you can learn to improve your skills.

[Ashen]

Interesting that you originally posted IN THE WRONG FORUM, about avoiding pissing people off... (This isn't really an AGS Technical question.)

As vertigoaddict says, there's a thread for recruiting peple to help with your game, so I don't see why it'd be a problem to use it If you can hold off asking until you've got the game completely worked out apart from the art, so much the better. Those type of requests can even have their own threads, provided they're developed enough.

there aren't any rules saying you couldn't make a game with crappy graphics then ask a person to re do and fix all of it

Not only is there no rule against it, I think it's what's most commonly recommended on the 'the more you've got to show, the more likely you are to get help' principal. If you've already completed the game, there's fewer worries about it getting abandoned and becoming a waste of effort for the artist, even compared to fully 'planned out but not started'.
At least, make a start with your own graphics (like a Demo game) and a fully developed outline (but in all honesty, that's the parts that's often stumps me, being artisticly challenged).

EDIT:
Oh, and to answer the most technical bit:

What I'm wondering is: If I made my own game using my limited artistic abilities, is it possible to replace everything (including walkable areas) in the game later with better imported graphics?

Yes. Depending on how the new sprites compare to the old (size, more frames in animations, etc, not quality) there may be a bit of extra work to do repositioning things and such, but it should all be fully replacable.

[radiowaves]

If all the game is planned out, then I am shure that a programmed base is better, you could do the gfx any time.
But if its a game thats story and presence is hardly dependent by graphics, or and idea started from a graphical idea, I find it better to do the gfx first.
As an artist, I always do at least half of the gfx first and then find someone who knows some programming.


Since this thread is here, I am not bothering to make another and ask my question right here too. How do you people actually plan the game?
I started writing the stuff down to a notebook and its a big mess now. I just can't keep things organized, every room is connected, has puzzles that connect everything else.. How should I organize it? I just can't write room by room, it just doesn't work.

[MrColossal]

Radiowaves:

There are tons of threads about how people plan games, do a search and you'll find them.

Dronon:

There's a thing called "programmer art" and it's a wonderful thing. This is art that a programmer does as placeholder so that they can continue programming the game and not have to wait for art to finish making a sprite for a badguy. You'll get little stick figures running around that artists then fill in later.

If you start the art but not stress over it and if the game is worth it to an artist [the story is great and the puzzles are amazing] they'd probably help. A finished game with a known list of art that needs to get done is better than a game idea some dude on the internet thought up and wants to do "some day".

[LUniqueDan]

Dronon :

If you'r not planning to change the game resolution or color depth - most the walkable area / regions and so on... will just need minor adjustements - adjustments that your going to do anyways during alpha/beta testing.

The danger of doing so is to get fed up yourself with a game fullfill of bluecups  everywhere, or - it's happening to me right now - an almost completed game where all the hotspots need to get redraw one by one (mine were just round spots).

Question to the mods/MrColossal:
If I like the question :

How do ppl plan their game

Should I : a) Dig an old thread?
b) Answered here?
c)Start a new thread?
or
d) take a glass of water and head to my bed?

[MrColossal]

If you have something that you think has not been brought up before and could lead to discussion by bringing an old thread back in AGS Gen... Dig it up. Don't dig a thread up to just to go "Yea, I agree!" or "I use wordpad to plan my games!" hehe

or take a glass of water and head to MY bed...

It's queen size, oh la la

[Radiant]

If your scripting is reasonably well-planned, you can substitute art for newer art without problems.

You should keep your planning flexible. If halfway through writing, you get a new cool idea, you should be able to incorporate it.

Arguably this is not the "best" way of designing things, but it is more fun like this.

[dronon]

Thanks everyone for your replies!  My apologies for placing the post in the technical forum at first, as I was worrying that importing new graphics would upset how the game's internal structure was organized.

I haven't read any of the posts on game planning yet, but I'm going to do so. I've followed editorials on the subject from time to time.  I have the general plot of the game thought out (and the ending, very important) and about two-thirds of the puzzles.  Aligning the puzzles to match up properly with good pacing - the timing of cause and effect after different tasks are accomplished - this I have not mapped out.  Plus I'll be learning about it all as I go along, and I know I'm going to have to change things.

So at this juncture, I might as well work up the confidence and see how far I can go with it, and if I finish the rough game from start to finish, then I'll know how much art I need for it!

[MillsJROSS]

Also, it might be a good idea to also to keep a list of who graphics/animations you'll need if you want someone to help you. Just so they have some sort of check list while their helping you. I completely hate creating graphics, and more likely than not, it's one of the walls that I come across.

The great thing about this approach, is you could get some descent beta testing done while you're getting your graphics finished.

As far as game planning goes, I think it's generally a personal choice, and you have to try and test a few things, and know what keeps you motivated, and what doesn't.

-MillsJROSS