Demakes or Remakes?

[Uhfgood]

To further work on my adventure game development skills, I'm considering working on both demakes and remakes, and then also original games based on already existing properties.

I would like to know what would be better/easier to START WITH, remakes or demakes?

And could you please explain why you feel one way or the other.

[Armageddon]

None, you don't own the rights to any existing adventure games. You could remake a scene from Monkey Island to test your engine but beyond that what's the point? Just make your engine and release it if you can't make games yourself. Also demakes require a lot of art and I can't find anything you've drawn.

[Uhfgood]

Obviously neither does anyone else that does them.  That doesn't seem to stop them, nor does it seem to put off anyone on the boards.  In any case I was considering working on remakes and demakes using ags.  Since the games are already created, I could get intimate with the process.  Also "Also demakes require a lot of art and I can't find anything you've drawn." -- as if anything I've drawn was a prerequisite to wanting to make them.  I think both remakes and demakes would require a lot of art and animation, which doesn't concern me.  If I decide to do one I will do the art required, regardless of whether anyone thinks it's good or not.

If demakes/remakes are neither better to do first, then it really comes down to choice.

Thanks for the discouragement.

[Khris]

I'd go for demakes, mostly since I like retro graphics so much.

And don't mind Armageddon, he's been like that ever since he got stuck in the pencil sharpener.

[qptain Nemo]

Well, the "you don't own the rights so tread carefully" part isn't discouragement, it's just reality. Personally I'd say if you want to mess with abandonware, go right ahead (though no one will be happy if you butcher a nice game, just saying), but if it's a live franchise you could be in trouble and, well, even just be a dick by making derivative works that authors don't really want you to make. Which you should respect, really.

Having said that, Oceanspirit Dennis and RON are completely open in that sense, so you can go remake/demake the shit out of them. OSD is probably not the best series to learn game design from, though.

As for your original question, I see "demakes" as the "obvious" answer because... well, remakes imply enhancements. To enhance something you need lots of experience. Since you put yourself in the position where it seems like you need to learn the basics, I'd say demaking is a more suitable route.

Not to mention demakes are cute as hell.

[Radiant]

Well, a remake uses better technology than the original, whereas a demake uses worse. It stands to reason, then, that a demake would be easier to do, as well as requiring less art resources. So how about you try doing Mask Of Eternity as an AGI game?

[Scavenger]

Generally I like to see remakes of games that could have used better technology, and demakes of games that used too much technology and sucked because of it.

So, Simon the Sorcerer 3D? Is in dire need of a demake.

But don't remake just any old game. Remake the ones that have dated poorly, and need some tightening up. Demake the ones that dated poorly, and could have been done better with older tech (So any of the early 3D games that were made just because 3D was popular.)

[Uhfgood]

Yeah I was looking into Simon 3.  I'll have to admit I haven't played any of the Simon the Sorcerer games to date, but have bought all 3 of them from GoG -- I also looked and saw someone started on Simon 3 and got as far as a demo (which I also haven't played) so there's that, but I don't think the developer has since worked on it for a few years.

(Basically being in the U.S. I don't know if the Simon games were even available to me, and I think I only heard about them since like the 2000's somewhere) but have been wanting to get them for some time.

Should be fairly interesting.

I'm playing Kyrandia 3 right now, so I have to finish that first, then I will play the Simon games.

So quite a few people are saying demake.  So I think I'll start with that.

It will be a somewhat slow process too, as I have other things and also i'm still working on my framework.  Once I get started, however, there will always be progress, be it at a slow pace.

Edit: Thanks for the suggestions!

[TheBitPriest]

Dealing with the issue of rights might be a problem (sell the game and it will be a problem!), but the last few episodes in each of the Sierra series need a demake.

[miguel]

My opinion is that if you really want to have lots of work remaking or demaking something that was already done, then go ahead. It will be tons of animations, dialogue and backgrounds not to mention coding...and it was already done before by experienced people...
My point is, think twice before diving into a big project, any kind of big project really. But having so much work on something that isn't ours is something that doesn't work with me. But that's just me.

Qptain Nemo mentioned OSD games (I'm also currently doing a OSD game between projects) and it looks like something you could work on as well as a first project. Or the RON series. RON is a great place to start that allows you to focus on scripting above everything else.

Because you wanted an opinion, I'll say that you should go original content all the way.

[Uhfgood]

Thanks for the suggestion Miguel, I'll keep it in mind.

I don't plan on selling any of it.  You're obviously right about IP rights and so forth, however, a lot of those in the forums are pretty well received.  So I may risk releasing them.

Even if I don't release them, I'm well aware there's a lot of work involved.  Of course the idea is that the design is all done, and for the most part so is the production design (that is the look and feel).  You know how art schools (I don't know if they do it anymore) have students recreate Renaissance artists masterpieces?  I see this as sort of the same thing. 

For instance, if I decide to do Simon 3, I'm going to actually be taking sprites from 1 and 2, and modifying them to match 3.  Also going to take backgrounds in an effort to make it look like it was made by the same people and process of the first 2.  At the same time I'm sure there's going to be some original art I'm going to have to make, that will have to fit in with that existing material.  It will help me learn the craft of adventure game development, and get me in the mindset.

Let's set aside legality, because I will never sell them, I may release them for free depending, or I may not release them publicly at all.  I'm not going to be ignorant of IP law, but I'm not so worried about it right away, we'll see if I just get through making one first.  In any case here's my plan, make a few demakes -- as most suggested in here you're actually trying to simulate earlier design/art from a later game, which means (potentially) less art than their original counter parts.  Next I am thinking of doing a few remakes, the reason for this is, I will have to be a little more creative, taking some old adventures, and improving them with art, maybe even design (especially since alot of the early adventures more notably the Sierra ones, have a ton of dead-ends/deaths).  So a demake might be easier/quicker, and then a remake a bit harder, however, like I said the look and game design are already done.  Finally I will make some original games (that weren't games before) based on existing IP (for instance I've always wanted to play a Macgyver tv episode as an adventure game).  What this will do is teach me how to create something original but give me some templates as to what I can and can't do.  For instance like some of the Indy fan games... I think an existing IP still provides a framework in which to contain your adventure game.  A bit better than just doing wholly original stuff, where you may not have any idea of how to visualize and map out stuff.

So TL;DR - I plan on doing a few demakes because design is pre-existing, a few remakes for the same reason but a bit harder since I may be adding extra content, original games off of existing ip because it would still provide a basic framework and focus the games.

Okay by this time, my framework should be fully functioning full graphical point-n-click adventure system (in haxe/openfl), and I will make my own wholly original games.

Btw I'm already making games with the current version of my framework as I build on it.

What I'm hoping is that this will make me a really good adventure game designer.

In any case thanks for all your advice, I'm really taking it to heart, not just throwing it out indiscriminately.

[Adeel]

Since you want pre-made content for yourself (which is not a bad thing at all to get started), I strongly suggest that you should make a RON game. The Reality On the Norm world is pretty vast and you can use all your crazy and exciting ideas to make the world more interesting. Check out the website, if you haven't already: http://realityonthenorm.info

Yes, slightly off topic but since you wanted an opinion...

PS: Many people here learnt AGS by developing a RON game, you will not be alone in that regard (if you are worrying about that).