Yufster HATE Thread.

[Robert Eric]

We don't dislike newcomers, we only dislike newcomers who dive into the community headfirst and bump heads with us old folk who are just trying to keep things settled.  Many newcomers have, instead of asking nicely, flat-out demanded help and acted rudely when help was presented to them.  They ignored the rules that we so nicely tried to spread about, and wreaked havok.  It shouldn't be so hard to see why we are so angry.  We will respect you all if you do what we ask of you and don't get out of line.  A joke post filled with swears and nonsense is (sometimes) okay every now and then, but we don't enjoy you guys doing it often.

[Las Naranjas]

This is the first thread in ages where people have felt compelled to actually write, then consider what they've written, and develop what they're saying at any length.
It's sad that it had to come in this form, but it's sadly true.
The homosexuality thread is an interesting case in point, since so many of the replies were only one or two sentences. There's little motivation when you feel that what you say might be flooded under a mass of single sentence mouth offs and excessive punctuation about how you mmisunderstood the onion.
Or at least "Aww, long posts! lol!". Really, if you don't like long posts, we don't mind, but that's not necessary.
I miss the lurkers. I mean real lurkers, who would spend weeks and weeks before tentatively offering something, and something that was worth offering.
This forum made me a rare creature, which is to say someone whose writing skills, particularly in constructing extended argument. Sure the forum's evolved and changed as a result of growing popularity, and perhaps the output is much higher, but there is no real doubt that the standard of donversation had dropped. Even if someone did have something to say, it would be skimmed over in efforts to encompass the entire mass of non comments and glorified zings.
I feel no resentment towards anyone who came after. It's not in essence their fault, or anyone's fault. They merely conformed to the changed standards of a forum which had gone from discussion to clamour. Maybe that's just the consequence of popularity. When AGS reaches half-life mod levels it'll be another matter still.
So maybe I'll just satiate myself with memories of a golden age, rotuinely glorifying them and polishing the sheen as time goes on, and be sad that I could never see how many of the newer blood would have reacted in a smaller environment where they may have been heard without a cavalcade of posts, inversely related to their content and attracting comments about the acoustic capabilities of empty vessels.
C'est la vie, and may we revel in our decadence.

[rodekill]

Well, I've never been the great debater around here, so I'm gonna make it a short one. Sorry Las.

I agree with a lot of what Helm said.

What do I think about Yufster, Jimi (Don't mean to single anyone out in particular, just the first names that came to me) and the other younger members? Well, I'm 24 years old. I can't really relate to them. The internet was a very different place when I was in my mid teens. I don't know what it's like to bring teenage angst to the digital masses for advice. All I had was black t-shirts and loud music. When I read posts about 12 year olds being madly in love I don't know what to say. Do what I did. Hide in your room and be depressed.

See?

The point is, I don't feel like there's much of a place for me here anymore. I try to post fun links and things, but they always seem to fall off the page within a half hour. I don't have a lot to add to most of the existing posts.

Unfortunately for us, things DO change, and we don't own this community. It's growing, and changing, and there's nothing we can do about it.

I'm lucky that I've made a lot of great friends here. People that I can talk to about stuff that no one in my real world understands. I've been inspired by so many people. The talent around here is scary sometimes.

That's the stuff that'll hopefully never leave the community. People can yammer on about their favorite movies or how their girlfriends goldfish died or how much Metallica sucks or whatever. As long as guys like DG stick around with their Photoshop contests, and guys like Neole keep cranking out the inspiration, I'll keep coming back.

In the meantime, I'd like to invite all you "odies" to add me to your MSN lists.
shawnguzzo@hotmail.com

Hmm. That wasn't too short. Kind of medium...

[Robert Eric]

By "odies," I assume you mean "oldies?"  Or, do you mean "oddies."

[rodekill]

There's a difference?

Badum bum! Yeah!

[auhsor]

Hmm, i'm away for a couple of weeks, and this happens. I don't know what to say - alot has already been said already.

I do agree with rode tho. Things do change and we have to accept that.
And yeah, i'm not one to write long posts. Sorry las.

Oh yeah, just so everyone knows, I am going to start finishing my game when schools over(november) - that is if i dont get a job or something...

[TerranRich]

I think we're missing the point here. I find it ironic that Helm defends himself as being rash and emotional, while he was the one who started a "hate" (dislike?) post for someone who acted exactly the same way.

Sure, Yufster's comment was harsh and sarcastic. Is that really any different than being harsh yourself, Helm? Now I'm not trying to start anything here, but I just think it's not right to verbally attack someone whose personality is probably just as high-strung as you are "given to being a bastard".

You talk about people having accepted you for who you were. Can we not do this for Yufster? ALlow her some leeway for being rude? Or is that only allowed for oldies? Should we have a Personality Gestapo around here, forcing people to follow certain personality traits until their second year here? I realize that Yufster is a newbie and has not contributed much as of yet, but that doesn't make her any less of a person than anyone else here.

I also realize that I'm not realyl an oldie myself. I've been here for little over a year. And I haven't contributed a game yet. Does that mean I'm useless and my opinion means nothing? I'd like to think I was welcome here, as anyone else is.

I agree with the people who said that Helm should have PMed Yufster instead of publically bashing her like that. Even *I* understand how Helm can be, but that was still too much. I think it was even CJ in another post that said to air out your differences and bashing in private. Sure Helm brought up a topic that needed to be discussed. Along with the 50 other threads that deal with newbie-ism and rudeness and the like. Plus, did that really need to be brought up? What did we accomplish that we didn't try to accomplish time and time before?

I, too, and sure that Yufster isn't crying over this. But I haven't seen her post for awhile and she's been MIA on IRC. Who knows what kind of AGSer Yufster would have turned out to be? She might feel un-welcome here now, all because her personality is too strong for some of us. When Helm first showed up on the scene, did people publically threaten him (albeit jokingly) and hope he didn't use his computer as much anymore? No. And look at him now. He's done tons for the community and I have nothing but the highest respect for him.

I generally stick to the Tech and Art forums now because of this forum. I agree with the one(s) who said that the General Forum should be shut down for good. It really should. It is most likely the reason that the entire forums have been down many times in the past. It contributes the most bandwidth to the entire forums and is really a waste. I mean, sure, it's a way for people to talk about random stuff. But there is a fine line between posting random rants and posting crap.

The solution to this is impossible. Have a system where the topic MUST be deep and of some importance to people. Yeah right, like that could be implemented. Maybe locking threads that have run its course is necessary. As well as locking duplicate threads, and threads that get out of hand. This is happening, to be sure, and it's still not really helping. New topics show up every second. I'm sure threads about the weather aren't really necessary. But there are still a lot of threads that have useful information.

Perhaps a new forum dedicated to new information and the sharing of neat tools found on the internet? I don't know if there really is a good solution to anything other than shutting down the Gen Forum, then re-starting it once everybody has promised to keep it reasonable.

[DGMacphee]

Dryhump:
We're not missing that point -- look at the first few pages and you'll see many users agree that Helm was out of line.

However, I am not a school teacher here -- I do not force users to stand in front of the class and apologise to Mary Jenkins for pulling her hair.

If Helm wants to apologise, that's his business.

If he doesn't want to, I nor anyone else cannot do anything about it.

What worries me most of all is that people take his forum so damn seriously.

My advice to everyone is simple: Get out of the forum and find something else -- make a game, paint a picture, write that novel, have something else in your life besides this.

Stop living your life through this community and using it as a chat service.

There are hundreds of greater things you could be doing than posting a reply to every single topic here.

Look at guys like Chrille or Spyros -- that've made great games and post sweet FA!

It's cause they don't need to.

So find something else to do -- make a game, communte, learn a new recipe, get fitter, procreate, send your kids of to a good school, learn kung-fu -- something else besides posting here!

It'll even make the Gen forum moderators' jobs easier too!  8)

[Trapezoid]

Although it's great when people contribute games to the AGS roster... if you post "sweet FA" then to relative newbies it just seems like you aren't part of the community. Just because you happened to discover AGS before other people, doesn't mean that you can hardly ever give the forums a spin and expect the newer members to know or care about you...

[DGMacphee]

Trap: Go play Pleughburg, Calsoon 1 or 2, or any of the Book of Spells games again or re-read some of the technical forum replies from Spyros -- Then you'll understand what Chrille and Spyros don't need to post anything.

If new people do their homework, they'll understand why these people, and many others, are important.

It's not because they discovered AGS before anyone else -- it's because they can utilise their time better with their contributions.

[Timosity]

I can Understand some of what Trap said, (that is for new newbies) but as time goes on they will realise who made what game, that's what's more important, not how much you post.

Also I noticed Yufster hasn't posted since these threads have been around, although I haven't been around as much lately (busy, work, socialising and working long hours on my game)

Therefore scaring her off I guess worked, but it's dissappointing for something like this to happen, just single out one young girl and abuse her verbally, just cause she got a bit post happy, we're not all nazi's around here, plenty of other people do the same.

If anything, she posted lots because she was getting a lot of attention from a lot of the males around here, so I don't blame her, it's really brought on by respected memebers with hardons.

[Paranoia]

newbie do multi threads for a bit of attention, and to get noticed, for whatever reason the internet seems to fill a void in peples lives and can become a obsession, i know  , i won't bore you with details but that happened with me, but i realized one day i was talking to people, who's marriage, and lives where wasting away on forums, chatroom, and i was doing the same!  theres a few ppl here that must do the same judging my the multi replies on this thread and others
i limit my self to replying to things that stand out, 99% of general is unread now, i look at MAGS coz i'm doing a game and a few other comps, and ask for help if i need it or help if i can
AGS is a good product, and theres a hell of a lot of interest, so all the oldies should feel proud of the attention it brings, jeez imagine if everyone of the members posted everyday, instead of the 20 or so that do.

Paranoia


OMG I'm hitting the refresh button, its starting again....noooooo :'(

[Femme Stab Mode >:D]

Why bash someone publicly, single them out, humiliate them, etc? Is there a kikme hate thread? Is there a Jimi hate  thread? Is there a Sasha hate thread, though I deserved it, remember when I posted LOTS  of hectic random shet? (sometimes I still do, 750 posts, SHIT) So if you hate somebody, I dislike some people on the forums but I don't go starting hate threads.

[juncmodule]

Arghhhh....

I just have to post something here.

When DG locked Helm's original thread I was extremely pissed. To see a very freindly approach to telling someone calm down get flooded with "no, don't pick on her!"-threads and then locked was just frustrating.

DG I congratulate your response in this thread. My respect for you has risen ten-fold. Your post about making games is the reason I continue to try to be a part of this "community" ("the reason" meaning the post, not the games, I will get to that in a minute).

A few months ago someone was writing a post and mentioned me as an oldie. That is just ridiculous. People know the community so little that they just blabber things off like that. I'm a newbie. I have made games and I am still a newbie. I will always consider myself a newbie.

When Helm posted in my Keptosh thread and said that I was part of the "people who have made a game group" I was honored, because it was Helm. And I mean "honored", not just grateful. It truly made me feel like more of the community. I knew that some oldies understood how much work I put into my game (even though the puzzles sucked). For me that is what being part of this "community" is about.

And Rode, if you stop posting or some shit I will track you down and bitch slap you. If I don't respond to all of your threads I at least read them and always find them entertaining.

On to the being part of this community from the games perspective:

If Chris Jones walked into my house, screwed my girlfriend, pissed on my cat, and slapped me across the face, I would STILL make adventure games. If Helm hates me, m0ds, DG, whoever. I DON'T care. I am here to make games. Finding a decent community is only a extra bonus. If you call me a newbie and tell me I post too much, great! If you ignore my posts (which most people do), great! I don't care. I love the fact that Chris Jones and AGS give me the opportunity to create adventure games. That is why I'm here.

The sad thing about the above paragraph is that the oldies now feel the same way. All they have left is the adventure games. The community is gone. That is why I am eternally a newbie. I feel that I missed something years ago. I know that I was not part of it and never will be.

If anyone, oldies or newbies, leave this community because someone posts some thread in the gen-gen forum. So long and piss off! You never loved what you were doing anyway.

I'm not really sure what people think of me here. I ALWAYS write long posts and for the most part they are always ignored and followed by short l33t speak replies. I don't have time to be concerned with all of that. Sure, I want to be part of an adventure game creation community...but, not at the cost of my games.

later,
-junc

[m0ds]

Looks like she's dissapeared now anyway.

[Hobbes]

Being a newbie, I would like to make a reply to that which has been said before. Looking at things now, I can see the reason in Helm's postings. Yes, I even feel ashamed because I have been here for over a year.

I even feel ashamed for making a statement against him before I knew what he truly meant. Helm, if you're still reading this thread, I am sorry.

To continue this: I still have to finish my first game. So as of yesterdayevening (when I first read this thread) I've started to work on it in full strength again.

I guess what I'm trying to say with this is: I agree with DG. I agree with Helm. I agree with what Junc just wrote... Make a game, don't make a mess. So I'm off to do that.

[Femme Stab Mode >:D]

good on you. You made a great n00b disaper. How great. Go on, go on, hurt people and make them go away. Make the world a better place.

[DGMacphee]

junc: I'm sorry I disappointed you when I first locked that post -- I felt a lot of regret soon after I locked it.


Sasha: We've already discussed those point -- Yes, Helm's post was inconsiderate.

Despite being inconsiderate, it's still an important sentiment, especially after discussing it with him.

Not only that, it's one shared by a lot of people I've spoken to.

Besides, you're supposed to have a bad arm -- aren't you supposed to be keeping away from your computer.


EVERYONE: We get the point -- Helm's post was rude, etc, etc, etc.

If you've come to this forum and posted here just to tell us that Helm was mean Yufster, please go away because we already know that.

And each time someone posts about it, I care less about it.

Besides, I'm more concerned about DarkStalkey than Yufster.

[m0ds]

[DGMacphee]

Mods, you're taking the joke too far now.

P.S. I've updated the rules -- please read them before posting from now on.