A jab or not a jab....that is the question

[BarbWire]

I don't know what the situation is in other countries, but in the UK we are being encouraged to take up the offer of
a covid 19 vaccination, when you are summoned. It will be available at GP surgeries, Pharmacies and walk in centres.
Vast amounts of people will undergo training to wield a needle. At the moment there are two Vaccines in circulation, the
Pfizer and Oxford-astrazeneca. There will be no option to choose which one is injected into you.

The Queen and Prince Phillip were innoculated on Saturday. It has not been disclosed which drug had the privilege of
being deposited into the Royal persons. No doubt a gold and diamond encrusted syringe was used, administered by the
top consultant in the country 

If I do decide to chance my arm, so to speak, I would like to be given a choice. The Oxford jab is preferable, to me,
because it is manufactured in this country. Very patriotic I know. I would like it to be given by a GP or fully qualified
nurse, rather than someone with no medical qualifications whatsoever. It is not known how effective any of the drugs
will be, how long the benefits will last, or if they will work when other variants of Covid 19 appear.

So, to have the jab or not to have the jab, that is the question 

[Mandle]

I would be first in line.

[Matti]

I would be first in line.

Me too, but that will happen in half a year at the earliest, as I'm neither old nor "system-relevant". Here in Germany there's the BionTech/Pfizer vaccine and as of today the second approved vaccine from Moderna will be delivered, but it's all going rather slowly. Afaik we won't have a choice either but I don't care.

I don't think there's much alternative to a vaccination when it comes to handle/stop the pandemic. Also vaccines are a great thing and usually quite harmless. The fact that there are so many anti-vaccers out there (spreading lies and fear) and that the overall willingness to vaccinate oneself is rather low gives me one more reason to vaccinate myself.

[Slasher]

Don't forget get to purchase the 'Vaccinated' badge so everyone knows you took it..

[Matti]

Is that supposed to be some sort of criticism, Mr. "Truth hunter"?

[WHAM]

Considering how good the track record is for vaccinations in general, I'd say go for it, get the jab. The risks are tiny and the potential gains are immense, although I also have to point out how massively optimistic a lot of people are with this thing. "Back to normal by June!" is a bit of an overstatement due to the availability and distribution of the vaccine, but phrases like that are repeated by media and politicians alike because it's what people want to hear.

It's actually kind of eerie to see people in elevated risk groups, especially the older folks on a medical peer support group on Facebook I'm in, boasting how they would "never take the jab" like it's some kind of accomplishment to be proud of. Same people are telling others to not take it, without any reason really given as to why other than "well I won't, so you shouldn't either". We had one vaccine with more than usual complications with the swine flu epidemic, and ever since then it seems the very word vaccination has become a curse in some circles.

[Slasher]

Is that supposed to be some sort of criticism, Mr. "Truth hunter"?

No... Actually, it comes straight off a FaceBook NHS/Co-vid advert.. I'm only quoting...

https://www.facebook.com/CovidBadge/posts/113925860590255

[KyriakosCH]

I thought that pharmacies can't be used for vaccination due to the risk of anaphylactic shock?
At least afaik here it is only done in hospital/other medical centers with doctors around.

[Danvzare]

Meh, get it. What have you got to lose?

[WHAM]

I thought that pharmacies can't be used for vaccination due to the risk of anaphylactic shock?
At least afaik here it is only done in hospital/other medical centers with doctors around.

That might vary from country to country, or maybe different vaccinations require different prep?
I mean we get a nurse to come in and jab us at the office for the seasonal flue shots and such, and I expect that will be the case with the Covid vaccine too, once it gets out to general distribution.

[Frodo]

I thought that pharmacies can't be used for vaccination due to the risk of anaphylactic shock?
At least afaik here it is only done in hospital/other medical centers with doctors around.

I got my flu jab done in the local football ground this year! 

No idea when I'll be allowed to get the vaccine.  I'm not in the over-80's group, but I do have some medical conditions.   
But when I'm invited, I'll definitely be getting it. 

[VampireWombat]

Where can give give the vaccination definitely must vary from place to place. Here, the civic center was the first place I heard of. And pharmacies and a medical clinic I hadn't heard of are the only other places I know of to get them at the moment. Due to respiratory issues, I was able to get vaccinated at the clinic on Thursday. My arm hurt for like 40 hours, but I'd say it's better than the alternative.

[Cassiebsg]

I'm sure I'll get my vaccine, once I get offered... probably before the end of Juni (since they think they can have the entire population vaccinated by then...) and then it's probably time to start vaccines all over again... 

[Stupot]

In Japan they’re not even planning to start jabs until the end of February. I’ll be happy to get it so that I can go back to the UK and see my family who haven’t even met my baby yet.

[Mandle]

In Japan they’re not even planning to start jabs until the end of February. I’ll be happy to get it so that I can go back to the UK and see my family who haven’t even met my baby yet.

Damn, that's a heart-tugging post, man! 

[BarbWire]

An Update:   According to the latest news bulletin, the jab will provide five months immunity. It might not work
for everyone and those vaccinated can still carry the virus. Big deal!  I would expect better protection, over a much
longer period.

When you think of life threatening diseases that were totally eradicated, in the past, with just one injection, such as
polio, smallpox, Tuberculosis, diptheria etc. I wouldn't say this innoculation is a scientific marvel.

I realise that there was great pressure on the virologists to produce an innoculation, as soon as possible, but maybe
slow and steady wins the race.

[Khris]

Can you add a source?
I've spent two minutes an Google and 5 months is mentioned here but that's after catching the disease, not after getting vaccinated.

(also: jab, I'm dying to finally wear my "Vaccinated" badge)

[Cassiebsg]

Moderna is claiming a year with their vacine.

As for how effective they are, well, depends on a lot of factors, including you not being allergic over for it.

[Danvzare]

An Update:   According to the latest news bulletin, the jab will provide five months immunity. It might not work
for everyone and those vaccinated can still carry the virus. Big deal!  I would expect better protection, over a much
longer period.

You've got to remember, that's probably only an estimate. Since I doubt anyone has been injected with it five months ago. Then of course there's mutations, so it's limited even in that capacity.
As for those being vaccinated still being able to carry the virus... uh.. yeah, that's how vaccines works. You just won't carry the virus anywhere near as long if you're vaccinated, when compared to when you're not.

Then again, I'm clearly no expert. So if someone here is better informed then me, then feel free to correct me.

[BarbWire]

Sorry, Khris, I couldn't actually find anything on google myself. It was on the BBC dinner time news. I am
pretty sure that's what they said, but if I am proved wrong I apologise. 

On the evening news it was reported that we now have another variant of Covid 19 in the UK. So, the South African
strain now been joined by one from Brazil.  Gloom and doom! gloom and doom!

[Cassiebsg]

The more grounds (read people & animals) the more it will mutate. Think I read somewhere that it mutates every 14 days... or was it less? In other words, the more it's "allowed" to run free and multiply, the more chances it has to mutate. So far these mutations seem to just be "more infectious"... just think if it mutates to "more deadly"? or "more infectious & more deadly"? 

We're down to 3 more weeks of lock-down (though not as confined as other countries) until the 7th Feb, because of "the British variant" and even though the number of new infected is dropping... (but they say the number of infect by this new variant is still going up)

[Snarky]

Sorry, Khris, I couldn't actually find anything on google myself. It was on the BBC dinner time news. I am
pretty sure that's what they said, but if I am proved wrong I apologise.

I'm pretty sure that, as Khris says, what you heard must have been about the report that having had COVID-19 provides (about 85%) immunity for 5 months.

I find it quite amazing that researchers have been able to develop not just one, but a number of apparently effective vaccines â€" in record time â€" when we had never before been able to bring to market a vaccine for any coronavirus in humans. (As I understand it, there were only some animal vaccines and some experimental ones.) "A cure for the common cold" (a coronavirus) has been one of those missing medical breakthroughs that people have talked about for decades â€" there's even an AGS game based on that joke!

[Mandle]

"A cure for the common cold" (a coronavirus)

Or Rhinovirus, or over a hundred other kinds of virus, although Corona virus and Rhinovirus are the main 2 culprits.

I'm no expert, but I suspect that is why we don't have a "cure" or vaccine for the common cold. Its effects are too trivial for most people to make such a regimen of tests and vaccinations for so many viruses, lumped under one heading, worth the effort.

And that it's not so much that a particular "Corona virus" in and of itself offers special challenges in producing a working vaccine.

But I could be totally wrong.

[KyriakosCH]

Sorry, Khris, I couldn't actually find anything on google myself. It was on the BBC dinner time news. I am
pretty sure that's what they said, but if I am proved wrong I apologise.

I'm pretty sure that, as Khris says, what you heard must have been about the report that having had COVID-19 provides (about 85%) immunity for 5 months.

I find it quite amazing that researchers have been able to develop not just one, but a number of apparently effective vaccines â€" in record time â€" when we had never before been able to bring to market a vaccine for any coronavirus in humans. (As I understand it, there were only some animal vaccines and some experimental ones.) "A cure for the common cold" (a coronavirus) has been one of those missing medical breakthroughs that people have talked about for decades â€" there's even an AGS game based on that joke!

When there is a huge monetary incentive, you'll see many offer products
That said, we haven't actually *yet* seen results of those vaccines on the general population.

[WHAM]

As with all vaccines, despite the rigorous testing, we'll also have to wait and see what the real effect on general populace is. Just yesterday the news here pointed out that Brazilian studies found the Chinese vaccine was 51% effective, far lower than the Chinese research had indicated, and just barely over the 50% required to be approved for use. If the actual effective rates among the population, as well as the time the vaccination is effective, are lower than hoped then herd immunity may be quite a bit of time away.

Still, in my eye this should only encourage more people to take the vaccine, in order to provide better data and understanding to the scientific community beyond that which their own tests can ever hope to achieve.

[BarbWire]

Hi all
It would appear that a five month test was undertaken, during which time somebody who had had Covid 19 and built up antibodies
still had protection at the end of this period. A person immunised also had protection until the end of this period. After five months
the effect may lessen but nobody really knows by how much. So, I was kinda right. I can see us all having arms like pin cushion if
we have to have constant injections 

[Danvzare]

So far these mutations seem to just be "more infectious"... just think if it mutates to "more deadly"? or "more infectious & more deadly"? 

Here's something to think about. If it was equally as infectious, but less deadly, it would appear to be more infectious as more people would walk around without realizing that they have it, and therefore infect more people. And keep in mind that if you come down really bad or even die for that matter, you're less likely to pass it onto someone else as you'll stay in bed. So it stands to reason that mutations that are less deadly, will also be more likely to spread. Meaning as time goes by, a very infectious virus should in theory become increasingly less deadly. Or at the very least, have a longer incubation period.
Also don't forget that your body starts to build up a tolerance to it (or at the very least, those who don't die are already likely to continue to survive).

In other words. There's a reason why the common cold was so deadly to anywhere we brought it to, yet it's now considered harmless everywhere. Not to mention how plagues in the past just kind of... disappeared.

Once again though, please take all of this with a pinch of salt. And if possible, I'd rather be corrected then continue to be wrong. 

[Reiter]

I think that I shall do what comes naturally - keep my tomato tucked in and do as I am told.

It will be a while before there will be a needle for me, but I shall take it when I am asked. Cleverer heads than mine have worked on this, after all. There does not seem to be any narcolepsy in this batch, at least.

I do detest needles, however. I am a baby when it comes to having them. It is terrifying, and I really do not want to have one. But I will have to, of course, so I will try to be a man about it. I suppose I could buy a lollipop on the way, and pretend the doctor gave it to me when I leave. I do hope the damned thing is worth it, but we shall see. EDIT: Apparently, the king and the queen had their dose today. Rather settles the matter; bring them on. I can take needles all day long.

I came out the victor in our first bout (I think), but I am quite aware that the second round may kill me all the same. This virus is a real maverick, it seems to do just about what-ever it please.

[Khris]

Digging this up because I finally got my first jab yesterday

With Delta on the horizon I'm really glad I finally got the offer, and I'll get the second one just three weeks from now, so I'll have 95% Delta protection at around the beginning of August.

My arm is a little sore, but that's it. Go get the jab, everyone!

[WHAM]

Got my jab a week ago as well, arm sore for a day and a half, nothing more.

My brother apparently managed to get some degree of side effects, and wound up bedridden for a solid week, though. Apparently he got moderate covid symptoms after the jab, but fortunately he didn't need hospital care and has recovered well since.

Gotta admit they've arranged the vaccinations nicely in here. You book your time online, show up, and the whole process took 20 minutes, of which the latter 15 were sitting and waiting for the mandatory observation period in case of adverse reactions to the jab. Big halls with lots of space for social distancing, lots of staff, good instructions and guidance all around. Will be getting the second jab in September.

[Danvzare]

I got mine at the beginning of May. Which I still find odd, since people my age weren't supposed to be getting it until a month after I got mine. 
But hey, I'm not complaining.

[Khris]

Yeah, same here I thought. Until they ended prioritization yesterday, apparently.

I was so happy a week ago that I managed to get an appointment at a private practice via somebody who used to work there, but right as I got home yesterday I got a notice from the vaccination center and could've gone there instead as early as today.

I hope that doesn't mean that given the low 7-day incidence here (~10) and the warm temperatures, many people are foregoing their appointments, but that's exactly what some official said is the reason for them sitting on thousands of unused doses. Goddamn fucking anti-vaxx fuckers (and by that I mean the grifters, not their victims).

[Matti]

I'll get my first shot in two weeks and because of the delta variant I'm quite happy about this too. I really hope a lot more people will get vaccinated over the summer, and gladly most of my friends will or already got vaccinated.

I'm definitely hoping for a better fall and winter than last year!

[heltenjon]

I got my first shot yesterday and feel fine. Very tidy and well-organized, I must say.

[Cassiebsg]

I'll be getting my second one on the 15th. 

My experience would have been like WHAM, except I ended up having to wait about 30 min. in a "line" that consisted of an area (where there was about 8 to 10 chairs), and you needed to self control when it was your turn...  The nurses/doctors come and called for "the next one" instead of pulling the names from the order in one each arrived (since by this point they had scanned our card to make sure we had an appointment). And when I sat I didn't noticed there was a row behind me (they were sitting against the back wall).  Can't say good organization was in place. 

[LimpingFish]

I'm set to get my first jab in the coming weeks. We're doing it by age group here, so I have to wait until the window for mine opens up. As for organization, we've now implemented it so any pharmacy (with the proper set-up) can also administer the vaccine. I presume other countries are doing something similar?

For convenience, I'll probably go with that rather than attending the main vaccination centre.

Regardless, if you have the opportunity to get vaccinated...do it!

[Stupot]

No word on my jab yet.

Japan has finally kicked itself up the ass and started opening the vaccinations right up. For the longest time it was old people and healthcare workers only, and it was creeping along at a snail’s pace. But now suddenly loads of people I know, if all ages, are getting their first jabs,

In Tokyo they’ve left it up to each ward to organize their own vaccination programs. Also some companies and universities have bought a bunch of doses and have begun mass-jabbing their workers and students. My company will do no such thing, and I’m still waiting for an invitation from my local authority.

One possibility is that my wife’s employer is vaccinating their staff and it is likely to cover family, so I could get my jab that way. It’s just a matter of when.

[AGA]

I've had both my jabs, as have my parents; my wife will be doubled up next week.  We've been quite lucky living in Wales, with a relatively low population, where 89.6% of us have had one jab, 67.2% both.

[heltenjon]

In Norway it's public vaccination only. The doses are distributed geographically and each county/municipality get a number of doses when available calculated from population and some other factors. There's been some public discussion about whether one ought to prioritize areas with a higher infection rate or not. In the municipality, it's going by age, except for risk groups or people with vital jobs, like health workers.

The health workers have been phoning people who's up for a jab, making appointments, but now when it's getting too many to do that, it's done digitally. I got a text message when it was opened up for my age group, and I then could order an appointment online.

We also had a queue sitting in chairs, like Cassiebsg described, except that we had a nurse stationed who told us to move to the chairs next to the vaccination booths. I would hazard a guess that my age group are more likely to interpret "to meet on time" to be there at the time given, while the generation before us would interpret it like "be there a long time before it's your turn". 

[Hobo]

Got mine as well a couple of days ago, no side effects, second shot in a month.
Good to see that so many are finally getting the chance to get vaccinated.

[cat]

Got my second 2 days ago. I went to a vaccination centre, it was exceptionally well organised, zero waiting time. About 20 hours afterwards I suddenly developed mild headache that vanished after taking a bit of Paracetamol.

The system here is very weird, it is done per federal district. In my area, I got my first jab in May already, while in Vienna, they only just started to give appointments for my age group.

I'm not sure if doing vaccinations at pharmacies is a good idea. In Austria there was the (rare) case that a person collapsed due to the jab, but the doctors there reacted quickly and administered some medication, so nothing serious happened to that person. That's also why you have to wait 15 minutes to make sure you are fine.

[Mandle]

Still waiting on my invitation from the Japanese government after 95% self-isolating for a year and three months now.
Don't tell my wife but I have had two affairs during that time.
The first was with YouTube and now I have a new thing on the side going with Netflix.

[TheFrighter]

You nasty guy! 

_

[Mandle]

You nasty guy! 

_

Maybe it's alright... I think she might be cheating on me with The Peaky Blinders... And who could blame her?

[Honza]

Got my second shot of Pfizer on Friday. Was a little feverish and very tired yesterday, nothing pleasant but also nothing horrible. Seems to have gotten better overnight, will see how today goes.

There's a lot of anti-vaccine scepticism in my country, the government has been confused and inconsistent with restrictions and communication around COVID, and nobody takes them seriously anymore. There is a steady supply of vaccines now, but it seems we won't get past the 70% threshold because people refuse to get vaccinated.

[Slasher]

About the same as in the uk...Preparing a 3rd and 4th Jab... People are now smelling a dirty big rat....

[Matti]

Oh, please elaborate and maybe even enlighten us, Slasher.

[Slasher]

Oh, please elaborate and maybe even enlighten us, Slasher.

I'm only saying what the general mood of a few fb groups are who are distrusting Boris and his mob in the UK and are saying 'enough is enough'...

[Mandle]

Oh, please elaborate and maybe even enlighten us, Slasher.

I'm only saying what the general mood of a few fb groups are who are distrusting Boris and his mob in the UK and are saying 'enough is enough'...

Facebook groups, is there nothing they do not know 100% and for sure?

[Honza]

About the same as in the uk...Preparing a 3rd and 4th Jab... People are now smelling a dirty big rat....

I think people don't realize it's a betting game and expect all or nothing results with everything. Solutions might not work out and new plans have to be developed, but most people still have to participate, even in the necessary mistakes along the way. To refuse to get vaccinated and then either a) be a free-rider if the virus is eliminated in spite of you, or b) go "I told you so" if new problems arise (or if it doesn't work because of people like you) is a pretty annoying strategy.

EDIT: I mean the generic "you", not you personally of course .

[cat]

I'm also against a 3rd or 4th jab now, but for the same reasons the WHO is: there is no proof that it is necessary and there are billions of people all over the world who didn't get even their first jab, yet. Better let them have it.

[Creamy]

The vaccination appointments have peaked in France last week-end. It coincides with the arrival of the summer holidays. There's nothing like the prospect of meeting many people to make you take the plunge 
Some people probably plan to travel abroad too. And some others may have anticpated the health passport that was announced tonight.

I got my first Pfizer shot 2 weeks ago. My arm hurt for a day and then I was fine.

[Stupot]

Still no word for me. My wife’s getting hers in a week or two through her company, but it turns out that doesn’t include family after all, so I have to wait for my official invitation, which who knows when that will be.

[Mandle]

Still no word for me. My wife’s getting hers in a week or two through her company, but it turns out that doesn’t include family after all, so I have to wait for my official invitation, which who knows when that will be.

Yup, we are in the same boat. Supposed to be this week, but who knows. I'm getting pissed off because they are issuing "Vaccine Passports" for people traveling out of Japan from the 26th.
Must be nice... grrrrrrr

[Mandle]

A masterful debunking of one claim in the UK against the government for wrongful harm via the vaccines.
You will laugh 'til you cry or cry 'til you laugh watching this, but, either way you will at least laugh, but varying on the individual it may be earlier or later.
(Anyone notice anything interesting about this dude's face as he sits in a confined room with a policeman?)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJMfnVeo7XY

[Khris]

Got my second jab yesterday, yay!

Also, that video did get hilarious in the end, I didn't expect

Spoiler

flat earth

[close]

to make an appearance

Slasher, get the fuck off facebook.

[Slasher]

A masterful debunking of one claim in the UK against the government for wrongful harm via the vaccines.
You will laugh 'til you cry or cry 'til you laugh watching this, but, either way you will at least laugh, but varying on the individual it may be earlier or later.
(Anyone notice anything interesting about this dude's face as he sits in a confined room with a policeman?)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJMfnVeo7XY

Got my second jab yesterday, yay!

Also, that video did get hilarious in the end, I didn't expect

Spoiler

flat earth

[close]

to make an appearance

Slasher, get the fuck off facebook.

Hi Khris, this man Keri Mullis, Nobel peace prize winner and PCR test inventor must be a liar or it's a  fake video! Shame he died some time later..

https://youtu.be/MkqQIY7J0fQ

Make your own minds up...

[Matti]

Kary Mullis denied AIDS being caused by HIV, the ozon depletion, climate change.. and believed in astrology. I don't think I want to listen to him, and I also don't really care what he thinks about Fauci.

[arj0n]

https://youtu.be/MkqQIY7J0fQ

Make your own minds up...

Please don't spread false info, Slasher. That RT-PCR test for SARS-CoV-2 was specifically designed to identify the presence of that type of coronavirus, no other, which makes that video unrelated to Covid19.

[Khris]

Slasher:
I don't think he's a liar, I'm pretty sure he's convinced that what he claims is true. The problem with this video is that a) he does make some valid points and b) we don't hear any response to or analysis of his allegations.

I'm certain that any current (or past) HIV expert could immediately point out a bunch of flaws in Mullis' claims. Why would anybody take Mullis' claims on face value? Just because there's grainy video of him making them? What kind of standard of evidence is that supposed to be? If I posted a video of Fauci as a response, would you consider your beliefs invalidated...? Hardly, I guess.

Also, the poor guy believed in astrology, so by the exact same logic I could argue that anybody who believes in something as obviously nonsensical as astrology shouldn't be taken seriously about anything else either (especially if their claims are about fields they aren't an expert in).
Note that I do not argue this, because that's a fallacy (the one you're committing).

Also, bonus appearance by Lanka, a German "doctor" who claims the measles virus doesn't exist.

[Slasher]

OK, point taken guys...

[Mandle]

Getting my second jab on August 9th and so excited to start learning how to use all my new magnetic powers!!!

Does anyone have any advice on how that all works?!

[Cassiebsg]

I haven't figured that out yet, let me know if you do... 

[Galen]

Got my second jab last week. Next anti-vaxxer I see will bow before Vaxneto:



Although currently all I got was a bit of a headache and a killer fever the following morning.

[Mandle]

Second jab achievement earned today but still no signs of magnetic powers except feeling repulsed by anti-vaxxers, but I already had that ability...

[Mandle]

Feeling pretty sluggish the day after the shot, but no fever yet.

EDIT: I spoke to soon. A few hours later and fever is here: 37.9 C

[Stupot]

I got my first dose of Pfizer this morning (thanks the Mandle, who hooked me up with a doctor who had enough stock.

I felt a bit weird a few minutes after the jab, so they kept me waiting a bit longer just to make sure I was okay. Then by early evening I already had a low-grade fever.

[Slasher]

Sorry to hear that Mandle and Stupot have gotten a fever, even though only mild... They warned us of side effects... Hopefully you two guys will pull out of it soon and return to good health 

[Mandle]

Sorry to hear that Mandle and Stupot have gotten a fever, even though only mild... They warned us of side effects... Hopefully you two guys will pull out of it soon and return to good health 

Yup, was just a 24 hour issue. Back to normal now. Thanks for the concern!

[Khris]

Quick reminder, this is what happens when you are more afraid of a mild fever than a potentially deadly disease that will fuck up your lungs and brain:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/aug/08/rightwing-radio-host-dick-farrel-anti-vaxxer-dies-covid
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-57958358
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-dorset-58080116

[Stupot]

Thanks, Slasher. It was really just a mild temperature, though. I’ve had way worse fevers in the past for seemingly no apparent reason and lived to tell the tale. At least with this I knew that the reason for the fever was that the vaccine was doing its job and training my immune system to recognise the coronavirus.

[Sinitrena]

Pfizer for me as well. I had a headache for my first jab (though that day we had 35 C here, so it might have been due to the heat) and a fever of 38.4 C and pain all over my body, in every joint and every muscle, like an intense work-out and the flu combined, for my second. Would do it again, can recommend! 

Seriously, unless you're unable to get the shot because of some kind of preexisting condition, do get it. These side-effects are so worth the protection you get.

[Laura Hunt]

Pfizer here too, no fever. My arm was sore for a couple of days and I had a headache, plus a bit of fatigue, but it was so mild that it could just as well have been due to a rough night's sleep, and I was perfectly fine the next day. I've caught run-of-the-mill colds in the past that made me feel much, much worse than that.

[fernewelten]

2x Biontech / Pfizer. I've been formally counted as “completely vaccinated” (as per the German definition) since the start of August.

I didn't get any ache; got by with some tingling in the arm that got the jab and some fatigue. Both times the effects went away within 24 hours.The second time around, the effects were more pronounced than the first time, but even then it was just a nuisance, I wasn't hindered or incapacitated in any way.

I did refrain from doing sports or manual work on the day that I got the jab and the day after, as per the doctor's recommendation.

The first time around, getting vaccinated was still a Very Big Thing: I'd telephoned a central hotline for days and days to get an appointment in any of five vaccination centres in a 40-mile radius, with no luck whatsover. You weren't allowed to put your name on any waiting list, but “feel free to try again in some hours' time.”  Then I got lucky at last in my family doctor's office. The vaccines were rationed and so I had to prove that I was even entitled to get the shot.

Five weeks later, they had set up a tent on the parking lot of the local supermarket. “Come in droves, tell friends and acquaintances, we've got plenty of all the brands. What's keeping you all?” I got my jab and bought some salad afterwards. Oh my, how times have been changing!

[fernewelten]

There's a very good argument for getting vaccinated:

All the other measures are meant for protecting the bystanders, not so much yourself. For instance, by wearing a surgical mask, you are mainly filtering your own breath that might contain the virus so that it won't reach the bystanders.

This means that if you go to some public event, you are at the mercy of everyone else abiding by the rules. If some aren't, you might be exposed to a superspreader event without being wise.

You can check at a glance whether everyone in the room is wearing a mask, but try checking at a glance whether everyone in the room that claims to have been tested negative in the last 24 hours has actually been tested with a negative result. There's been some shenanigans going on, and some “official” testing stations have actually been caught at certifying a test that they haven't actually done. And those "antigen" tests that are usually used for this so-called "passporting" haven't really been designed for that use case; they aren't really reliable enough although they are still used that way.

Unless ... you're vaccinated yourself. Getting vaccinated is a measure that is designed to protect you yourself from a "severe" course of disease and that is effective at protecting you even if not all the bystanders are playing by the rules.

[Khris]

On German twitter, #Testboykott is trending. You cannot make this up.

From October, people who can get vaccinated but won't have to pay 15 Euros to get tested, so the anti-vaxxers are calling for a boycott of restaurants and other venues where only vaccinated or tested are allowed...
It's like US conservatives burning their own Nike shoes or trashing their own Keurig machines because the company did something "woke" for PR reasons.

These people also keep posting how in Israel, way more vaccinated than unvaccinated people end up in the hospital, which is of course no surprise if you are capable of doing 5th grade math.

Why are these idiots? When will it end.

[Danvzare]

From October, people who can get vaccinated but won't have to pay 15 Euros to get tested, so the anti-vaxxers are calling for a boycott of restaurants and other venues where only vaccinated or tested are allowed...

So they want to boycott the places where they won't be allowed in unless they pay 15 Euros to get in, which they probably wouldn't be willing to pay for in the first place?
...
That's like me saying I'm going to boycott all football video games, when I've never played and have no intention of ever playing a football video game in my life. 

[Stupot]

Talking about side-effects, I haven’t pooped since my jab.

[heltenjon]

Talking about side-effects, I haven’t pooped since my jab.

I think that's an end effect.

[Danvzare]

Talking about side-effects, I haven’t pooped since my jab.

It's quite possible that's just a coincidence.
Or a side-effect of a side-effect. 
You know what, forget what I just said and go drink a gallon of prune juice or something. 

[Khris]

Right-wing nutjobs have reached the "Maybe evil, sly leftists tricked us into dying from not being vaccinated using reverse psychology" stage of the pandemic.

breitbart.com/entertainment/2021/09/10/nolte-howard-stern-proves-democrats-want-unvaccinated-trump-voters-dead/

You've gotta admire the mental gymnastics these people are capable of though.

[Danvzare]

Right-wing nutjobs have reached the "Maybe evil, sly leftists tricked us into dying from not being vaccinated using reverse psychology" stage of the pandemic.

That's basically just right-wing nutjobs admitting that they think the leftists are smarter than they are.
I mean honestly, how dumb do you have to be to believe you're dumb enough to be duped by something so simple, yet still smart enough to be right while they're wrong.
That lack of logic is staggering. 

[Stupot]

Such bullshit, even for Breitbart.

If I wanted to use reverse psychology to convince people not to get a life-saving vaccination, I would do exactly what Stern and the left are doing... I would bully and taunt and mock and ridicule you for not getting vaccinated, knowing the human response would be, Hey, fuck you, I'm never getting vaccinated!

In actual fact, the "leftists" have only ever been urging everyone to "please get vaccinated" over and over a-fucking-gain. Any ridiculing comes only after those people have argued against vaccination for the umpteenth time using memes and YouTube as proof.

I don't really care if they think they've been tricked. As long as they can finally admit the vaccine can save lives and get the fucking shot, so that my family can finally fucking meet my son.

[Khris]

Oh man, that sucks.

It is very funny on a certain level though: Republican tier 3 influencers are essentially killing their own base by telling them not to get vaccinated, however they sincerely believe their own BS so they aren't vaccinated either and are all dying of COVID, too.
Tier 1 Republicans are all vaccinated of course, even if they are lying about it. Even funnier is that Trump had a rally and told people to get the shot and promptly got booed for it. You just cannot make this up.

What makes this less funny is the people who are suffering, and I'm mostly talking about the ICU docs. Last winter they were stressed out and overwhelmed by people dying left and right from a new and deadly disease. Now the ICUs are full of people dying again, but this time around there's a safe and effective vaccine. I cannot imagine the exasperation and frustration on top of the long working hours and the fact that sometimes these people get harangued or even threatened by the families because they didn't give the latest Darwin award winner* some horse deworming paste.

(*having said that, most of these people are actually victims, too. Victims of trauma, victims of psychos peddling distrust in science, etc.)

[Danvzare]

Does it bother anyone else that whether or not you're for or against vaccination is tied to your political beliefs?
What if I don't want to get vaccinated but like the idea of socialized healthcare?
Or what if I want everyone to get vaccinated but hate the idea of immigrants coming into the country?

The whole Left vs Right thing makes no sense.

[Cassiebsg]

Apparently over there there's only white or black, tone variations or colours don't exist. You're either for or against. 

[Khris]

Apparently you've never seen this?

[Ali]

Does it bother anyone else that whether or not you're for or against vaccination is tied to your political beliefs?
What if I don't want to get vaccinated but like the idea of socialized healthcare?

Why would you expect things that are of great political significant to be unconnected to people's political beliefs? I would expect people who are in favour of socialised healthcare generally to be in favour of mass vaccination, because both involve state intervention in the interest of public health. Of course, people do hold views that aren't self consistent. But it's weird to think of political opinions as existing in a vacuum.

[Stupot]

I think Dan's point, which I agree with, is that most people who are against vaccination aren't against it because of some well-reasoned opinions based on their own nuanced political belief system. They're against vaccines because they only trust what the right-wing meme generators and shit-stirring YouTubers are telling them to believe.

Particularly in America. Yes, some anti-vaxxers might be able to point to [what they see as] genuine reasons based on their politics and might even be able to explain it somewhat articulately, but most of them just simply want to do the exact opposite of what Biden or anyone on the "left" is asking them to do, because WHOOOHOOO MURICA! That's not politics, that's stupidity.

[Ali]

I think there's - arguably - some correlation between stupidity and reactionary politics.

[Khris]

Just found the perfect website:

https://www.sorryantivaxxer.com/

Found via YKS episode 219 (jump to 7 minutes in)

[Sinitrena]

Is that really a "perfect" website, in any sense at all?

What good does it do? It won't change the opinion of a single anti-vaxxer - on the contrary, I'm pretty sure it will make them even more obdurate, if they even see it. Most people don't react very well to being put on the spot like that. And for people who are vaccinated, what purpose does it serve but to make them go "See, see, these idiots brought this onto themselves!"; thereby creating an even greater rift in society.

No, this website is counterproductive.

[Khris]

This website is for people on the fence, who think they're "healthy" so they don't need the vaccination, or who are more afraid of the side effects than of COVID thanks to online liars.

[Khris]

Harrowing thread about dead brother, shortly after dead dad: https://twitter.com/RachelMcKibbens/status/1458881015917678594
They refused to get vaccinated, didn't follow doctors' advice and relied instead on nutritionist cousin who's anti-vaxx and getting his health advice from TikTok apparently.
They also believed in conspiracy nonsense like vaccinated people shedding stuff that makes you ill / get Covid.

If you're reading this and aren't vaccinated yet, please try not to make the list. Get the jab.

[Mandle]

I have a weird hobby where I follow the Flat Earth debates and, while most people would just ask "Why even bother with those people and their nonsense?", I have found an answer to that question. And I also found my own answer of why I felt that the Flat Earth belief is a dangerous cult.

When I first discovered the existence of Flat Earthers, about 3-4 years ago, I started watching the livestream debates against them, thinking that probably this was all just a ridiculous scam of YouTubers acting the parts of Debunker and Flat Earther to just get clicks and money.

And now, here we are 3-4 years later, and I know that it is not just an act. Somehow people have been convinced by social media scammers that the Earth is actually flat.

Okay, now why is this a dangerous belief, and how does it relate at all to the subject of this thread?

Well, to believe that the Earth is flat is the ultimate gateway conspiracy. Even putting aside the stupid theories that America lied about the moon landings, or that aliens crashed at Roswell...

Those are NOTHING compared to Flat Earth.

Believing in the Flat Earth requires that you believe that every single government on our planet is involved in an effort to conceal the shape of our world. And that they have been doing so for at least hundreds of years. This means that every war for hundreds of years, including WW1 and WW2 and the entire Cold War were just staged events to protect the lie that every government that is obeying our shadowy leaders concealed.

It requires that you accept that everything you have ever believed or been taught are all lies. And that every government and media source are in on it and helping to spread the lies.

And that is why it is the perfect gateway conspiracy.

Almost every Flat Earther that I personally know is also an Anti-Vaxxer and also a QAnon believer and THIS is where the harm that social media causes comes in:

They all sit in their little echo-chambers on YouTube and Facebook or whatever and build their beliefs in the deception of the great shadowy "THEM" to the point where they are willing to do the opposite of drinking the coolaid at Jonestown:

They are willing to reject the vaccine because, once you can believe that the Earth is flat, you also must believe that everything your government or the media says are also lies.

Which brings me to my rather harsh point that two major Flat Earth leaders, Rob Skiva and "Flat Earth Fokker", have both died within the last month from Covid after releasing many videos on YouTube about the "Plandemic" and how the vaccine is a poison designed for population control.

Now, here comes the horrible part: These two men have died. No, that is not the horrible part. I am actually glad that they are dead as their influence on social media definitely caused the deaths of hundreds, if not thousands, of their followers who believed them about the vaccine being poison.

Those kinds of people are better off dead for the betterment of humanity in this case.

Yes, this is a heartless thing to say. They had families and people that loved them who are grieving, but SO did the hundreds or thousands of families they believed their Anti-Vax bullshit and also lost loved-ones.

No, the horrible part is that the followers of these departed nut-jobs are just doubling down and believing that their leaders just got "too close to the truth" and were assassinated by the New World Order government to protect their plans.

Their leaders have DIED through their fucking ignorance and arrogance and that has only strengthened the belief of the cult they have built.

I am horrified by our rejection of science and experts in favor of the most popular trends on social media of these "Truthers".

They are a worse virus than Covid will ever be and will cause more suffering and death in the long run.

[kconan]

Which brings me to my rather harsh point that two major Flat Earth leaders, Rob Skiva and "Flat Earth Fokker", have both died within the last month from Covid after releasing many videos on YouTube about the "Plandemic" and how the vaccine is a poison designed for population control.

Bill Burr has a great rebuttal for that idiotic conspiracy theory.  "Why would you kill off the obedient ones?"  I mean there are 137 reasons why its stupid, but I like that point.

The truth is boring, and stupid people feel smarter when they "know the real truth".  I started to get very worried about the weaponization of misinformation when the PizzaGate thing happened.  Sadly, I think its only going to get worse.

[Crimson Wizard]

how the vaccine is a poison designed for population control.

Bill Burr has a great rebuttal for that idiotic conspiracy theory.  "Why would you kill off the obedient ones?"

I have an idea. It's all the other way around. This vaccine is not against covid, it's against another deadlier virus that is not here yet. What would be the most efficient way to separate obedient and rebellious people? The world government would fake the covid and spread vaccine, so only obedient people who easily believe in their lies would vaccinate and rebellious won't. Then they would release a real virus for which there's no other defense, and all who did not comply will die.

[heltenjon]

how the vaccine is a poison designed for population control.

Bill Burr has a great rebuttal for that idiotic conspiracy theory.  "Why would you kill off the obedient ones?"

I have an idea. It's all the other way around. This vaccine is not against covid, it's against another deadlier virus that is not here yet. What would be the most efficient way to separate obedient and rebellious people? The world government would fake the covid and spread vaccine, so only obedient people who easily believe in their lies would vaccinate and rebellious won't. Then they would release a real virus for which there's no other defense, and all who did not comply will die.

Please, somebody make a game out of that idea!

[Mandle]

I have an idea. It's all the other way around. This vaccine is not against covid, it's against another deadlier virus that is not here yet. What would be the most efficient way to separate obedient and rebellious people? The world government would fake the covid and spread vaccine, so only obedient people who easily believe in their lies would vaccinate and rebellious won't. Then they would release a real virus for which there's no other defense, and all who did not comply will die.

Sheer genius!!!