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#721
General Discussion / Re: Tropes vs Women
Sat 03/08/2013 18:09:05
There's no point denying that the damsel in distress is one of the most commonly employed tropes in game design - or any other story-telling medium for that matter.

Why? The short, simple answer is that mostly males make games, and we like to tell stories that are personal and relevant to us. Making the protagonist male is just closer at hand - and if the one you're saving can also be a romantic interest, you have an effective and functional dramaturgy right there.

What really bothers me is when designers resort to gender stereotypes, with no interest in exploring their characters' depth. If the female character is only a sexualized, weak, silly girl, and the male is only a strong, battle-hardened, emotionally inhibited lone wolf, then you have a problem. (Every action/adventure movie from the 80's and 90's.)

Or if only the male character is nerdy, knowledgeable and witty, and the female part is pretty and popular, waiting to be won over and finally accept the hero's shortcomings, thanks to his genuine, geeky charm. (Modern geek comedies, Big Bang theory and similar shows).

Or if the female is enigmatic and quirky, fleeting and singular, like a mythical hind in the forest, full of mental scars and commitment issues. (Garden State, Eternal sunshine of the spotless mind, lots of indie dramas).

A problem arises when designers try to remedy this by just reversing the gender roles, because that can appear patronizing instead. "See, in our game, the girl is super tough, and she beats up men! That's radical and correct, isn't it?" No it's not - you're just pointing out that women need some sort of special treatment to compensate for stuff.

I hated the way the female protagonist in "The girl with the dragon tattoo" was portrayed, because it was basically the typical victim turned revenger. The Swedish title was "Men who hate women", which is a pretty straight-forward title, but what we saw was a girl who (justifiably) hated men. Is writing a novel like that modern and forward-thinking? No, because it still discriminates. It still victimizes women and put them on some sort of morally superior pedestal.

Now, a truly modern, non-stereotypical story would have a young man be taken advantage of by various women, and end up taking revenge on them. Because if we want women to appear strong and independent, they too must be able to handle ending up on that end of the spectrum.

Sure, we can avoid the clichées and stereotypes the best we can, but as long as mostly men create games and design characters, male heroes will predominate, and they will be better explored and more deeply portrayed, and more often than not will the recipient of their assistance, and the target for their romantic efforts, and the prize for their endevours, be female.
#722
Okay, I've gone ahead and fired up a workshop. I didn't exactly compromise very much on my initial idea, but hey, we can do the portrait thing next time :)

Also, about Mittens - do check out the Mittens clause.
http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=48770.msg636463932#new
#723
Latest update:
Keep posting concepts/sketches until Monday 19th. Everyone who's published something by then will be transferred to the second round, which will get a separate thread with more instructions.

ILLUSTRATION WORKSHOP - BOX ART EDITION

Alright, summer's not quite over, so before we're forced back to jobs and schools and shit, let's have another round of Illustration Workshop.

This time, we're going to make box art, as in, the type of paintings meant to trick kids into buying games that they wouldn't buy if the box just showed an actual in-game screenshot. I remember buying Bad Blood solely for its amazing cover art, and while the game wasn't exactly lousy, the graphics inside were... different. During the 80s and 90s, painting cover art for games was probably the most advanced form of fraud still legal. Nowadays, the discrepancy is far less flagrant, which makes me a bit nostalgic. Kids these days just aren't being fooled the way I was!



Seen here: discrepancy

THE PROCESS
* Registration will be open for four days. During that time, all you do is write here that you want in.
* You will then be allotted a random AGS game from the AGS game database.
That's right, you will not be working on your own game, nor a game of your choosing (nor a silly generated name), but a real, already existing game that somebody else has made. This does entail some legal issues - you'll want the author's permission before using the illustration in a portfolio or another "official" context - or if it gets troublesome, you'll just remove the title.
* We'll spend one week making sketches and concepts and discussing ideas. We give our fellow artists some feedback on their ideas.
* We then spend a week developing characters, putting text and pictures together, work on layout and composition. We finish this period by giving everyone a round of c&c.
* The last period is used refining and finishing our pictures. We add details, highlights, textures etc.

ABOUT BOX ART
* Box art is used both to give the buyer an idea of what the game is about, but also to attract them. It has to be interesting, intriguing, impressive, while consistent with the style and genre of the game.
* Box art almost always features the main character, so it's important to get an idea of what that character is all about, and to make a - more - realistic representation of him/her.
* Box art also has a title in a nice, fitting font type, so that's one more element to take into consideration.

ABOUT THE GAME SELECTION
I will generate a random game for every participant, but will first make sure that it
* Is less than 3 years old - it's funnier to work with a fairly new product, and it's also more likely that the author is around (to give their approval/disapproval)
* Is playable - it's probably useful to play at least a minute or two to get a basic grasp of the style, and get to know the protagonist.
* Isn't a commercial title - copyright issues will be less of an issue if it's freeware.
* Hasn't already got a cover illustration - the above clause probably reduces the likelihood of there being one, which is good because it probably feels more "real" if your picture will be the only one.

If I choose to participate, I'll simply let another member select my game.

REMEMBER!
The serious, professional-sounding nature of this competition may deter some people from participating, but remember that most members are complete amateurs when it comes to digital painting. Consider this a really good opportunity to practice your skills, in a very educational and helpful environment, and the competition aspect is just a minor part of it.

MITTENS TIME EXTENSION
People attending Mittens will be given 5 extra days to work on their pieces. We could wait until after mittens, but that would delay the whole activity so much we'd risk other members choosing to prioritize work or studies (I will just have started working myself). I hope the 5 extra days is enough of a compensation.

LINKS
Previous workshop: http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=48175.0
and: http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=48324.0
Some really good - and really bad - boxes: http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/slideshow/278111/video_game_box_art_gallery_best_worst/?image=1

My own illustration gallery (couldn't help the plug, sorry!!) for whatever reason: http://andail.cgsociety.org/gallery/
#724
You say you've made your own inventory... but you haven't scripted anything yet? Sorry, but Ags doesn't run on magic :) How about you open a template game and check how it's scripted, or look up inventory in the manual? We can't really go through the entire chapter of inventory scripting with you point by point, I hope you understand that!
#725
Critics' Lounge / Re: Background Critique?
Wed 31/07/2013 20:35:42
When you say "too many colours", what do you mean exactly? Too many to pass for a gameboy game? Or too many to look good?

Depending on its purpose, I think it's looking really good. Of course, there is a certain stiffness to it, and it does come across as traced, but if the entire game has a style that matches this look, it's fine. Is this a 1st person adventure? One issue I foresee, otherwise, is that a non-antialiased character will have to scale a lot up and down to fit.

As for the composition, I'd probably either center it perfectly, or make it more definitely right/left oriented. Now it's slightly awry, which isn't harmonic.
#726
Eric, relax, we're just voicing opinions here, why would I be upset? If anything, I was the one sounding a bit harsh when I dismissed your master class proposal :)
Let's keep throwing around suggestions, and on Saturday I'll get something started up.
#727
I'm not personally interested in a character workshop, and spending a whole semester on one character is just not realistic (nor necessary). But if that's what people want to do, I'll just wait with my box art idea.
#728
Take a look at recent successful adventure games and you'll find a vast range of genres and styles. If you're too conscious about trends and fads, it's only gonna give you a headache when you're a third into your project and the trend has changed slightly. People who only worry about how their games will fit the market will constantly switch between projects, and never finish anything, and if they do it won't feel genuine anyway.

Just because whacky comedy is not currently as big as during the heydays of LucasArt doesn't mean it's not viable. I think comedy is inherently more difficult to pull off, and perhaps more people are hesitant to give it a go. Comedy is a sensitive field, because if you don't appreciate it, you'll probably just find it irritating.

I think you should consider an adventure game a story that you want to tell. Do you want to tell a story? Then tell it. If not, go create something less plot-driven.

#729
Ok, I've been thinking lately about the trophies for our various competitions. The situation now is that members have all sorts of various - often strange-looking, often non-showing - trophies in their signature, most of which are completely unrecognizable.

I know some people think it's a fun part of running a comp to also design the trophies, but not all do, and not all bother to even create trophies, and again some create trophies that look really... funny.

So, my suggestion is that we implement a set of standard trophies. I present the following reasons:
* It will become immediately clear how many times a member has won a certain competition (people won't have to guess)
* The trophies will - generally - be better made
* It'll save time for competition hosts who really don't want/have the time to design new trophies
* The trophies will be safely hosted so that they don't risk disappearing

If we decide to do this, we'll obviously have to design a set of trophies for each of the most recurrent competitions, and vote which versions we want.

I'll leave this thread open for a couple of days. If a majority of members don't think it's worth trying out, we'll simply keep doing it the old way. If there's enough support for my idea, I'll open a competition thread for creating the new sets of trophies (a competition that will also be given trophies? OMG meta-trophies, J/K).

Now, most people don't think this is a big deal, nor do I, really, but summer is the time for spending time on trying out new things.
#730
Hm, I strongly disagree. I can almost guarantee (trust me as an art teacher here:)) that being given a random game will improve the learning experience vastly, plus I think it makes the competition more fair (no preparations in advance, etc).
Getting another person's game also mimics the experience of being a freelance illustrator, where you don't have a ton of emotional investment in the subject.

I'm also having second thoughts about waiting until after mittens - that's almost 3 weeks away, which means that most (other) people will probably have started working/studying again. Maybe we should get going as soon as possible, and then we could always set the final deadline well after the end of mittens, giving those participants some extra time.
#732
First I was thinking a box art workshop - every participant will be given a random game from the Ags database, and the finished result will be something that could work as a box/cover illustration. Then there was a background painting round that used splash screens for a theme (imaginary but still) so I figured it had been done already.

If people don't mind the unoriginality, I really like the idea, because it's s complex design that needs to take style and genres into consideration, as well as more refined versions of the characters, but still everyone has an idea of what such an illustration is all about.
#733
Yeah, I've thought of starting a new one, but wanted OROW to finish, and also as you say waiting for mittens is probably a good idea.
I'd happily administer it. We can discuss the theme here, and eventually I'll go for whatever seems viable. And fun.
#734
The unique mechanic here seems to be a complete lack of freedom. "Want to drive to the destination? Click Drive to Destination. Want to get out and enter the bar? Click Get Out and Enter the Bar." I bet every time you press the wrong button, Jim Walls is gonna pop up and tell you how you didn't pay attention to proper police protocol.
Reminds me of the golf game Bart got for Christmas present.
But hey, it's 3D!
#735
Kids?
#736
General Discussion / Re: FaceShop
Tue 23/07/2013 23:50:21
Regarding copyright:
If you just use the photograph as a loose reference, there's no copyright infringement to speak of (virtually impossible to notice, literally impossible to prove).
If you just manipulate it a little, or reproduce it very faithfully so that we're talking a derivative work, you have infringed the copyright, but there's no chance in hell anyone would notice it, much less care. Unless perhaps it's a really unique and famous photo, and it's very obvious that you've stolen it, and you're making lots of money of it. Then maybe you've got a problem.
#737
Good stuff!
I'm genuinely interested to play the rest!

I particularly like the writing. I think both games have some serious literary qualities. I'm thrilled!

Grundi's art is steadily improving, and it's fun to see some examples of great animation (even though other actions lack animations altogether). Ben's background art is great as always.

The Reaper has a great atmosphere and cool scenery, however I'm not too fond of the puzzles so far. Especially the walking back and forth to the power switch just felt like a way to increase the game length.

Both games have puzzles which are mainly about finding various items scattered across the screen to use on something electronic until it works, sort of. I frankly don't know how many games I've played now where you're supposed to open a panel and mend/replace a fuse or some kind of circuit until electricity happens.
No offense, just wanted to find something that wasn't totally awesome!

Looking forward to see whatever comes out of this cooperation!
#738
Great minimalistic graphics and really funny in all its dirtiness!
#739
Ok, the demo is a bit old by now but I still thought I'd offer some comments.

I'm really impressed by the level of detail - all the animations must have taken forever to make.
I'm not personally a fan of 3D-rendered graphics, but I can still appreciate how well made this was.

I think you should cut back on some of the commentary, especially the "witty" ones, because that kind of comedy can easily become exhausting. I also dislike it when the narrator talks directly to Rosella and vice versa, as it totally breaks my immersion.

I accept that the protagonist can die (only been killed by the shark so far), because that's the spirit of Sierra, and furthermore I did get some warning, so it was avoidable.

Really good work, so far, with only some minor issues!
#740
3.2.1
Also parts of the error message is in Swedish, so as I said the problem probably isn't just within AGS.
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