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[A game is released, but NOT included on the main page of the RoN site. Instead, people have to vote on whether it should be included in the RoN timeline or not.]

It's very interesting to read this thread and hear why people are turned off by RoN.  It was a long time in coming. 

The RoN artwork standard (set by Yahtzee in the first game) was never BAD per se, but was specifically designed to be very simple and easy to replicate.  What ended up happening was people creating extremely crap graphics and thinking it was OK.  RoN's graphics aren't support to be BAD, just very very simple.  If *I* can replicate the style, than anybody could.

It seems that the major turnoffs are

1- the large number of games
2- the artwork
3- lack of newbie support

#3 can be easily handled by directing people to the AGS site and a redesign of the site.  #1 and #2 are a mixed bag.  I liked the democratic nature of RoN, where anybody could create anything, but in thinking it over it's obvious that the project got too big.  Way too big. 

The really bad games have extremely crap artwork, and there are (let's face it) a large number of them.  Removing them, or seperating them, would kill two birds with one stone (reduce the number of games, and raise the overall standard of the games)

Part of the original appeal of RoN was taking part in an active universe, but there was no real effort needed.  A 12 year old kid could write a game with Davy Jones saying "Boo!" against a blank background, call it a RoN game, and it would get put up on the website.  Seperating the underchievers, the lackluster efforts, and the (to be blunt) crap games from the rest would go a long way in making RoN shine again. 

Perhaps a voting system could be implemented in order to cannonize a game?  A game is released, but NOT included on the main page of the RoN site.  Instead, people have to vote on whether it should be included in the RoN timeline or not.    This could go a long way in improving the quality of future games, since people will create games to impress (and get rewarded for it) instead of vomiting something up in 5 minutes (and getting the pleasure of seeing it on the web).

As for the current games... yes.  Pruning is needed.  Yesterday I would have said no, but I see why it's needed now.  The current system worked well when RoN was in its infancy, but it's obvious that it's not working anymore.  There are too many games, and a hefty percentage of them are awful.  If that's what is turning people away from the series, then by all means let's fix it. 

Hi aNboy,

The Wadjet Eye store can take orders from almost anywhere in the world.  It can definitely take orders from India.  The game ships from the U.S., so if you want the CD-ROM version there will be an international shipping charge.

edit: and thanks, sin!

Hm.  In talking with others about this, it seems people might be misunderstanding my problem.  Maybe so, maybe not, but here's a simplified version.

Basically, all I want is to create a link button within my game. 

Hopefully that clears things up.  Any advice is appreciated.

-Dave

I've been thinking alot about this, and I've come to some conclusions.  The more I think about it, the more I think RoN was a product of its time. 

If you look at the AGS games from 2001-2003 you won't see a lot (some, but not a lot) with beautiful graphics or excellent coding.  Heck, RoN got started at a time when "Rob Blanc" and "Larry Vales" were considered top of the line.

So, the fact that RoN games were a bit unpolished, or short, or unfocused wasn't a problem for most people, since almost EVERY game released had these problems. 

2003 was the last year that RoN was really active.  By "active" I'm talking 1-2 games released every month. 

Since then, RoN has been fairly dead.  Also since then, the bar for AGS games has been raised.  People expect better.   If I released "Postman" or "Purity" now, the reaction would be totally different.

The problem with RoN isn't the inconsistancy of the world or the inconsistancy of the artwork.  It's the inconsistancy of the public's taste.

Atlantic City is within driving distance of NYC (well, a few hours anyway), so I might go just for kicks. I admit my curiosity is piqued. It's like a train wreck that I won't be able to turn away from.

Again I ask, what inconsistancies?  As far as I can tell (and I've played every RoN game), the community has done a pretty good job of policing itself.  I don't remember there being two shopping malls, and who says there can't be two?

I'm basing this model on Aveyond, which downloaded with a midi soundtrack but you had the option of downloading a full orchestral score.

The file you downloaded was an installer program, which automatically searched for the game folder.  I'd do the same thing with the speech.vox.

In talking to various portals about distributing Blackwell, the main concern is the download size.  180MB is a bit too heavy for the casual market, and the agreement was to nix the voice pack (which takes up 140MB) but make it a seperate download. 

I thought it would be nice for the player to be able to click a button within the game labelled "Download Voice Pack" and then have the game access the internet and grab the file.  Is this possible to do? 

-Dave

"Don't expect great games" is a bit unfair. "Don't expect great LOOKING games" is a bit more accurate.  The point of RoN, originally, was to create a shared universe for people to create stories.  If a game had nice art, it was a bonus, but it wasn't a deal-breaker. 

I don't think art is the major problem here, as a number of the characters were redrawn by Wogoat and look darn sweet.  He did that about three years ago, and nobody bothered to use them. 

-Dave

Sphinx never got off the ground, and from what I understand it's pretty much dead.  Comparing RoN to Sphinx isn't terribly fair.

The art style inconsistancy was part of the appeal, actually.  The first game set the standard - the graphics weren't stellar, but it was a style that anyone with a paint editor could mimic.  In theory, anyway.  Over time, better artists created better versions of the sprites and backgrounds, which were more of a treat than anything else.

Quality Control is a mixed bag.  As mentioned earlier, we shouldn't delete the crap games because we don't like em, but instead devise a way to show off the nicer games while leaving the crap ones to languish in obscurity. 

I would hardly classify RoN's cannon as "rigid."  People are pretty much free to do anything.  The davy jones death thing was the only major hurdle the series ever had, and that occured right at the beginning and was quickly dealt with.  The community didn't ignore it, but instead made it a bit of a running joke.   

As far as the inconsistancies go... what are they?  I knew the RoN history very well back in the day, and I don't remember any plot inconsistancies.  At least, none worth talking about. 

Lack of community support for new authors is a good point, although what else can be done if somebody announces a RoN game?  Nobody is going to help you make your game.  What else can the community do but wait?

Sigh.

I had hopes for this.  I really did.  Despite my feelings about Howard and Malinche, despite the whole thing looking like a train wreck waiting to happen, despite my intentions to not go, I was hoping to be proved wrong because the adventure community could use something like this.

I feel like the prophet of doom who is disappointed when the end of the world actually comes.

Also, re quality control for avoiding poor chapters... why not have a filter here in the AGS Completed Games to avoid those inane first-games as well? It's the next step.

There's a difference between the AGS games database and the RoN database.  If you want to find out about RoN, you look at other RoN games.  If you want to find out about AGS, you don't necessarily have to look at other AGS games.

The oldbies here on this forum all know about RoN.  They either made a game (or more) then moved on, or they never wanted to make a game in the first place.  None of these people plan on making a game, so saying "just make a RON game" isn't the answer.  I know we all hate newbies, but RoN is a community that needs a steady influx of them to keep it going.  The "problem", if there is one, is how to get the word out.  Not how to get the current community members more active.

Fangames aren't taken too seriously, I've noticed.  At least at first.  Keep plugging away, is my advice.

Hm? Misunderstanding?

Like if you make a really good game that a lot of people like, then maybe you could get an actual company to help make and sell the sequel?

I'll say first hand that this rarely happens.  In talking with publishers, they are less willing to take over someone else's IP (intellectual property).  If a publisher is going to shell out money for someone to make a game, they want to be sure that they can market it properly.  A sequel to an existing IP would be very difficult for them to sell. 

You can make a good game that a lot of people like, and then get a publisher to sell/market a NEW game, but not a sequel.  There's too much risk involved.

Actually, Klaus was the guy who set up the whole eCommerce section of the Wadjet Eye site, so your best bet is to get in touch with him.  He did an awesome job with it.

Bleh. Don't use osCommerce.  I used it for five months and it was nothing but trouble.  It's primarily used for shipping physical products, not for online downloads.  The online download portion of it was buggy.  A good 1/3 of the purchases never went through properly, and I had to go in manually and give the customers the game for free.

Cubecart is free to use, although you get some nice extra features if you pay for it.

I've been tempted to try out something called Plimus, which would be good in your situation.  If you're acting as a 3rd party publisher (or an affiliate) Plimus will automatically calculate all the commissions and such and pay everyone accordingly.  It's something I'm looking into, because it will mean a lot less work for me.  It does cost money though, but I don't think it's huge.

Hahaha.  Brilliant.  I wish I could get people willing to work for only $250 per month.  This must be a fantasy game.

Don't forget voice actors!  And marketing.  And team members who flake out at the last minute.

As for quality control that Dave talked about, there are a few RON games by an author I won't mention by name so not to offend him

Das right.  To bi sure,

Anyway, I still have a soft spot for that lil town.  As I said in another thread, the goal isn't to get folks like me or Creed or Grundy or AGA to make another RoN game.  It's to get talented new people making their own. 

This is funny considering Dave Gilbert released a lot less games than Yahtzee and 2 of Dave's projects are from the Bestower/Blackwell series and he already announced he'd release 2 more Blackwell games to make it a trilogy.

Three Blackwell games?  Who said anything about three Blackwell games?

I'm making five. :p

And yes, I want all your money.  I have a coffee habit that needs supporting.  And a dog.