Gay, the insult

[Snake]

Yeah, you are surely right, but it pisses you off because they are making fun of you. If they were making fun of you and calling you anything else, would it piss you off less?

No, it wouldn't. I don't like being made fun of period (bad childhood experience long before that).
But why do you think it's wrong to be offended? Personally, I don't find anything wrong with being gay, you're still a human being are you not? I had a gay friend in highschool, I have a gay uncle and two other people that are very close to me are gay.
It just pissed me off being called something that I'm not (who are brothers and I loved very much) - I was offended. And there's nothing wrong with it.


--Snake

[Oliwerko]

Emerald. Suck my balls.

No, seriously, I have brother, and he pisses me off (ok, he does not call me gay, I admit) so I think I am involved enough.

Snake - that was exactly my point. We were talking about the fact that when someone calls you gay, you are more offended than when the person calls you somthing else (faggot, anything). From what I understood this is not your case. I am too offended when my brother insists on something that I know 100% is not true (wheter concerning me or not) but that has nothing to do with that gay insult. Your case is different. When I wrote that it is not OK to be offended when being called gay, I meant it concerning previous posts - that the bare fact you are being called gay is offending more than just being called something unpleasant. If my friend said to me that I am an idiot, it's ok. When he would say to me that I am a gay, is that different? Should I react angry and become offended despite the fact I wasn't offended by being called an idiot?

(Hope you will understand this post, I am tired and have a little difficulty writing properly  )

[Stupot]

With me, I don't think it is necessarily the fact that my sexuality has been questioned that is insulting, as such... it's more the fact that something about me must have led that person to feel the need to ask, and it makes you self-conscious... Also, the more serious and understanding that person tries to be about it, the more condescending it is.  Perhaps that adds to the anger.

It's obviously a mixture of factors, but homophobia is by no means part of that mixture.

[m0ds]

It's funny how the term "gay" gets thrown around. Between hetros most people in my culture would find it one of the least offensive things to say. And of all the homosexual guys I know the majority of their conversations are hinting at "I'm gay" and they generally love it when you remind them. So saying "You're gay" to them isn't an insult, its a fact.

To counteract that though, I suppose "trying" to insult someone is bullying. But it'd be so much better if companies or what not made out they were pissed at the offender for bullying, rather than for being offensive, because there really is nothing offensive about actually stating what somebody is (if they are actually gay! if not then surely its just silly banter). In fact it makes the person saying it seem like a fool. I can see though, in a restaraunt, why an argument like this would kick off. You shouldn't be using bad language in front of customers, "bitch" obviously meant to be an insult as was "you're gay". So I perfectly understand why it would cause a commotion so far as managers are concerned, but why the guy had to react so badly to being called "gay" is a bit OTT...

I think it depends on culture to culture how offensive using the word gay to someone can be. In the UK there is definitely a high tolerance to the word, its used in banter & it really is one of the least offensive words. I also think the people who are offended are getting mixed up with its definition. It once meant happy, then it meant homosexual, but nowadays I get the impression it just means "Crap." Take for example, Shawn of the Dead. My favourite closing line is the fat guy, bleeding at the neck, says "Gaaay!" lol. Obviously he meant "crap" and not "homosexual" (but yes he wasn't trying to be offensive). Anyway, I feel in this country at least, the term "gay" has faded out, using it as an insult even moreso. Back in the mid to late nineties when the wider world was only just coming to terms with gay porn, gay marriages & gay celebrity icons - it was considered very rude. But nowadays, I wouldn't even bother using it as an insult, because I knew if I did, I'd get laughed at for its stupidity, or "non" harshness. People these days say c**t if they want to offend

So, I'd say the waiter is either secretely gay (the 'bitch' part makes him sound it) or he's a  homophobe. Anyone else I know would've laughed and said "whatever".

Anyway this was a funny thread to read. It reminds me of working at Virgin. We had to put stickers on damaged/returned CD's/DVD's, and on one label I wrote; "It just stopped working...gay!", and was subsequently fired for it because someone 'upstairs' who was gay was apparently offended. I guess that completely screws up everything I just said, cos it wasn't being used in the 'homosexual' term yet I got compromised for using it. OH WELL. GAAAAAAAY

[SSH]

Emerald. Suck my balls. No, seriously

So, this proposition implies that you ARE gay...

[Oliwerko]

Hahaha, didn't realize this sentence in this context yesterday, it was probably bad topic for a joke like this.

I can tell you, from all "evidence" my brain gives me, I am certainly not gay.

I can see though, in a restaraunt, why an argument like this would kick off. You shouldn't be using bad language in front of customers, "bitch" obviously meant to be an insult as was "you're gay". So I perfectly understand why it would cause a commotion so far as managers are concerned, but why the guy had to react so badly to being called "gay" is a bit OTT...

That's what I was talking about, Snake. In this particular situation there are no other factors between "bitch" and "gay". They are both meant to be offensive, and when the person reacts to "gay" much more angry than to "bitch", that is the case we are talking about.

If it's in a family environment/friends/whatever, there are more things you are offended by. Not just the whole fact that they call you gay. I can understand that perfectly. I just can't understand why some people aren't offended when you call them "bitch" and are offended when you call them "gay". THAT is weird.

[Snake]

Oli, I'm glad you brought up being called an idiot. You know, because of the past experiences that I've had, plus my own take on the world, I am most certainly more offended being called an idiot - even if some one is kidding (it still irks me 'till this day) - than being called gay or anything else that has nothing to do with homosexuality.

I mean, the only times I was actually called gay and they meant it was my brothers - other than that my friends and I can joke about it all day long - act like we're gay and say different things to eachother and everything's fine with the world. Like I stated earlier, I  have no problem with people that are gay.

Heh, I'm probably going to open up a can of worms and get myself into shit with at least one person around here, but fuck it - I'll admit it. The only thing I find myself shaking my head over and saying "what the fuck..." and being, well, maybe more annoyed than anything, is when I see those "stereo typical" gay men on TV having the body movments and that goddamned "stereo typical" lisp that almost everyone makes fun of. It just pisses me off - and these people are honest-to-God gays and are the most flamboyant, prancy-dancy men I've seen.
For once, on TV, I'd like to see a gay man not act like this. It's like the world is trying to say that the only gay men that exist act like that - and, in my opinion, I feel that is absolutely not true - and I'm sick of it.


--Snake

[Oliwerko]

TV is evil, you know. Powerful evil. And yeah, these TV gays are just a stupid joke. If they wouldnt do these things, people wouldnt realize that the person is gay! They got to do that!

[Hammerite]

i honestly agree.

[Stupot]

Its amazing how many real gays do follow that stereotype though...  A lot of them really do have that voice, and one guy I worked with a little while ago actually admitted to it that he used to put it on before he came out.  But he did it so much that it became second nature and now that is just how he speaks.

I can almost vouch for that... when I went on a school camp in 1997 there was a group of Irish scouts there, and some of us were hanging around with them.  A few of us, myself included, began putting on an Irish accent for a laugh.  The boys didn't mind, it was funny... anyway by the end of the week I was the only one still doing it and I realised later that I had been pissing everyone off, so I decided to try to slip back into my normal voice... it was difficult... for some reason I just couldn't seem to get out of Irish mode...

I think it is similar with gay guys.  They put on the voice at first for whatever reason - personally I think it's their way of hinting that they are gay without coming out - but by the time they do come out, this voice has become their own, and the longer they have been putting it on for, the harder it is to get out of 'Big Gay Al' mode.

And with gays it's not just the voice but all the poofy little gestures and poses and facial expressions... they do exist... not all gays act this way, but some most certainly do...

Stereotypes are there for a reason, they're not just some image created by TV to make certain groups of people look stupid.

There is also the 'Gay Gene' argument, but I'm not having any of that.

[Snake]

TV is evil, you know. Powerful evil. And yeah, these TV gays are just a stupid joke. If they wouldnt do these things, people wouldnt realize that the person is gay! They got to do that!

No no, I'm not talking about TV sitcoms. I'm talking about HGTV, MTV, etc... those type of shows that have real people in them.

But, yeah, I agree too with sitcoms being like that. Some pull it off quite well and are funny - like that show, um... I can't think of the name - all I can think of is Will and Grace, but that's not it... or maybe it is, I don't know. I haven't seen it in years - but there were two gay guys in it and they were great.

//--EDIT--//
I stand corrected, the only gay guy I remember seeing on MTV that acted nothing like what I pointed out and what STUPOT pointed out, was the black guy from one of the Real World seasons - Chicago, I think.


--Snake

[miguel]

Stupot: it's not the 'gay gene', but the hormones!
some males have more female hormone than other, it is a cientific fact. If you add social environment plus unconventional  childhood, it can boost what those individuals will try to hide.
There are more gay people in the world than we aknowledge, and some get famous, and if you see them on a cheap TV show than it's like every other person in it, they are cheap and stereotyped people!
To be gay is the same as to be hetero in everything except the gender of people you fancy. There are cool, interesting gays and there are some vulgar ones! Just like everybody else!

[Layabout]

If a girl called me gay, I would simply reply with, 'If I am soooo gay, then why have I been checking out your tits the whole time?'

In theory it should work.

I've been subject to the gay name calling before. It's pointless to get angry over and even better to play along and freak people out.

[voh]

Gay's used here too, in an insulting way, or simply to mean something's bad "That's so gay" - meaning that it's stupid.

I'm entirely straight, I know that for a fact. And because I'm secure about that, when somebody asks me if I'm gay, or tries to 'tell me' I'm gay, I'll usually opt to go "Why don't we find out" and wink slyly.

They generally bugger off.

If a gay dude comes up to me, I'll talk to him like I would to anyone else, but as soon as it becomes obvious he's interested in more, I'll simply tell him no, and they'll generally understand :p

[MrColossal]

but as soon as it becomes obvious he's interested in more, I'll simply tell him no, and they'll generally understand

"I'm sorry, I'm only interested in the midnight rendezvous under the pier... I'm not taking you to meet my parents..."

"I generally understand..."

[SSH]

When I started driving a pink car, people at work used to make jokes but I just said "Does the pink car threaten you, somehow?" and that usually stopped them.

[Emerald]

I have to say... the comebacks, guys, are just embarrassing...
(Said in the same tone as Joey)

I suppose it's more about how you say it than what you're saying, but daymn...

[Ultra Magnus]

When I started driving a pink car, people at work used to make jokes but I just said "Does the pink car threaten you, somehow?" and that usually stopped them.

A pink car? That is so gay!

I'm kidding! Jeeze, chill out!

Anyway, my standard comeback has always been...

Them: "You're gay."
Me: "Yeah, you wish."

It gets the job done. 8)

[Buckethead]

Why did you decide to drive a pink car anyway? I don't think the colour is pretty enough to go through all those immature jokes.

[Emerald]

Them: "You're gay."
You: "Yeah, you wish."
Them: "Why would I wish for that?"
You: "TAKES ONE TO KNOW ONE!"
Them: "I'm not following you."
You: "I know you are, but what am I?"
Them: "You. Are. Gay."
You: "So is your face!"
Them: "My face is flesh, muscle and nerves. It can't have a sexual preference."
You: "So is your mother!"
Them: "I grow ever weary of this tiresome exchange..."
You: "Your mother is a whore!"
Them: "Good sir, I take my leave of you."
You (to friend): "LOL. I totally outsmrted that asshole..."
Josh: "Yeah, that was awesome. Let's make out."


...
I don't know why I did that...


Edit:

I, too, am rather interested why you would pick a pink car. I mean, that's kinda asking for it...
It's like, being a regular in a gay bar and complaining when people make assumptions...