Japanese Practice on AGS

[Stupot]

I was thinking of making a program on AGS for practising Kanji and vocab for Japanese.  If that goes well I could even try and implement some grammar games.  It would help me to revise as well as giving beginners something to play with to learn some basics.  And as I learn more I could add more content.  And If I wanted to be REALLY ambitious I could include listening practice and sound files for all the different words and oh Jeez the project is already too big for me and I haven't finished coming up with the idea yet.

Any thoughts, comments, suggestions, advice etc?

-Stu

[Update - Dec 1st]
Here's a basic plan of what I want to achieve:
http://docs.google.com/Doc?docid=0ARi4Vvjmz7BqZGM4ajIzY2ZfMGNkeGYzaGNz&hl=en

[ThreeOhFour]

Any thoughts, comments, suggestions, advice etc?

Do it bit by bit

Implement it in a very basic version, see how that goes, and then expand it. Get lots of feedback.

Good luck - I think it'd be fun to play around with, because I remember very little of the tiny bit of Japanese that I learnt as a kid, so I'd have fun trying to remember some of it

[Scarab]

Well I definitely think it can be done, there are already many language-based games on the internet, and I spent many a French lesson in the computer labs in my youth.

I think this was the site we used to go to, or something with a similar name.

[TerranRich]

One problem with new ideas like this (and I should know) is wanting to do everything in the first go.

Just start off simple. A basic teaching game for Japanese vocabulary. Then, have future games include grammar games and other additions.

[Wonkyth]

As I'm going to commence learning Japanese next year, this sounds awesome!
I cant think of anything specific at the moment, but if I find time I'd be happy to render myself useful.

[FSi++]

Just start with kana, and expand it.

[DoorKnobHandle]

Can you do Korean as well? Don't know_how_ related it is but I'd be heavily interested in that.

[monkey0506]

Yes and while we're just adding random languages could you include German as well. I'd like to learn my mother tongue.

Just kidding...sort of.

This reminds me of Knuckles in Chinaland which is actually kind of fun. Especially in that it's "Chinaland" and yet teaches Japanese. Good luck with your project.

[Atelier]

Some ideas:
- Fill the gap
- Hangman
- Flipcard revision
- Select from list
- Audio revision
- Type answers

And will it be windowed, or fullscreen? Which age will you design it for?

[Snake]

Sounds great, Stu!

Take that, Rosetta Stone!

[Ali]

Take that, Rosetta Stone!

Rosetta Stone is the perfect name for a detective character in an adventure game that teaches languages! Make The Adventures of Rosetta Stone and teach me Japanese!

[Ethan D]

In my experience the best way to get vocab down completely is to write sentences with the word itelf in it, so if you want to help people memorize vocab, grammar should probably be done at the same time.

On a different note: This looks interesting, I kind of wish I had a program to help learn Japanese the four years I took it in High School.   Oh well!

[Gilbert]

While we're at this, note that unless you use only images (like Vince 12's game) or make the font files yourself, you cannot display Japanese characters with AGS, due to the fact that AGS supports only the basic 256 ASCII values in a TTF (and only 128 characters with SCI fonts). So, in general, AGS is not very suitable for making games with CJK texts.

There were some discussions about cramping in the hirakana and katakana characters into a font set and making translations some years back and I even made some tools with AGS that help you to fill out a translation source for that. There're some (not-too-obvious) links in my posts but I'm not sure how well these tools coop with recent versions of AGS and I think the links may be dead already. I may try to find the files if anyone needs that.

[Stupot]

Thanks for the feedback folks.

As suggested by FSi I will start off with Hiragana and katakana.  I'll also introduce some basic Kanji (numbers, days of the week, etc) and some basic vocab (dog, cat, table, etc).

I'll have a grammar section, but to start off with, I'll just have one or two bog standard structures ( 'A wa B desu' ).

When that's done I'll send it out for people to play about with and ask for suggestions and feedback.

@Gilbet - Yeh, I'll have to use image files for the Kana and Kanji, but I'm wondering if that's such a bad thing, as they can be included in the game folder and printed off as Flashcards.  It does mean I can't implement any typing quizzes though :-(

@dkh - totally agree, I'd love to learn Korean, but unfortunately I only know two words (but by all accounts their sentence structure is virtually identical to Japanese, so you'd still gain something from it).

[Wonkyth]

It does mean I can't implement any typing quizzes though :-(

No, it just means you'll have to be clever about it.

[Stupot]

It does mean I can't implement any typing quizzes though :-(

No, it just means you'll have to be clever about it.

exactly

What I'd like to acheive is to basically cover everything I learned in my first year at uni and gradually build on it as I learn... (not as I'm taught... the two are totally different kettles of 魚)

[DoorKnobHandle]

@dkh - totally agree, I'd love to learn Korean, but unfortunately I only know two words (but by all accounts their sentence structure is virtually identical to Japanese, so you'd still gain something from it).

Ah okay. Damn, I was hoping their alphabet would be very similar or something. Anyways, I'd still check out the tool, that's for sure!

[Stupot]

I've been working on a brief for this project and have already come across my first dilemma.

If you were to try this product, what would you prefer?

a) to have all the content (vocab, grammar, Kanji) available from the offset for you to browse at will?
or
b) to have the chance to 'unlock' handfuls of content as you progress, making it more like a game?

'a' would be good because you could just get stuck in and practice the stuff you want to practice.

'b', on the other hand, would appeal to the completionists (what I call the 'Pokemon generation', gotta catch 'em all!) and would be more stuctured.

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If I were to go with 'b' the structure would look something like this:

Level 1 is the Hiragana Katakana section, there will be flashcards, explantions and new vocab will be introduced.  A quiz will be played and passing it will unlock Level 2

Level 2 (and all subsequent levels) will have two "content" sections (a Kanji section and a Vocab section), with say 10-20 new items of each for every new level.  Each one has a small test to help the user memorize the content and once these tests are complete, the 'Grammar' section for that level will be unlocked.

Each level has a grammar section.  This section will explain a new point of grammar, and will utilise any new "content" words in the various examples...  If Kanji and vocab are the enemies then Grammar is the Level boss, taking the form of a grammar test or quiz.  Reaching a certain competency opens up the next level where you then have to start with some new "content"... and so on... up until about level 5 or 6 where...

you get to the metaphorical 'final boss'... The "reading" section!  This will take the form of a fairly sizeable chunk of purely Japanese text utilising much of the "content" and grammar from all previous levels.  To complete the game, the user must be able to read and understand the text and will prove it by answering a series of questions about the text.  When a certain competency is reached, the game is finished but you will be offered a chance to save it there, so that everything remains unlocked for the user to browse, as would have been the case in 'a'from the outset.

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Thoughts? opinions? rants?

[Wonkyth]

As one of the "Pokemon Generation", I like the sound of b.

[magintz]

Wow sounds good. I do like the idea of going slow. Perhaps release it episodic. Starting with the alphabet or similar. Definitely include lots of pictures to help. Try to use everything in a sentence. It makes learning grammar a secondary thing to learning pronunciation and words.

Perhaps use jigsaw like drag and drop slider puzzles to arrange words into proper grammatical sentences. Or Matching images to phrases.

B sounds good. I think it's more the approach schools take. You need to pass your exams before you can continue. If someone is using this to learn then this would be the preferred option. But if someone is lkooking for a reference or as a study guide then option a would be preferred.

What's to stop you doing both and letting the user choose what level they can play if they want? Ask them at the start.

Biggest advice of all... have a theme song