About Sprite Jam...

Nacho · Mon 17/04/2006 19:24:49

Recently, someone in Sprite Jam cheated... the whole thread is here:

http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/yabb/index.php?topic=26033.new#new

So, we started two discussions basically:

A) Should the guy be punished? Yes, no? Argument your reply.

And:

B) Should the sprite trophies be removed? Why/no, and argument your reply.

Now my replies: a) I was quite annoyed at the first moment when I saw the cheat... You can see that in my replies. Now I feel so much better and I think that I don't really care about a punishement (A permanent disqualification has been mentioned) or not. The guy may participate in future sprite jams, nobody will care, or will annoyed by his entries... But he will lose, because nobody is going to declare a cheater winner.

b)Trophies are not compulsory, you can make them, when hosting an SJ... or not!

So, what happens if you have won an SJ and that week's host doesn'tÃ,Â want to make a trophy for you? Well... You have won... Do it yourself!

I would see silly to make compulsory to any SJ host to make trophies. But in the same level we have the decission of prohibiting them, IMO...

MashPotato · Mon 17/04/2006 19:44:34

a) no punishment necessary.Ã,Â Everyone knows he cheated, so there's no real point
b) I agree that making trophies is not mandatory (and definitely should NOT be), but I think people will feel obligated to do it anyway, especially if it becomes a tradition.Ã,Â Having said that, I like the trophies and hope they stick around (but only if the host wants to make them for fun ^_^)

EDIT: reworded to make myself more clear ^_^

edmundito · Mon 17/04/2006 19:58:44

a) I think the biggest punishment is that he will completely lose credibilty in all future sprite jams and that now he has to regain the respect from everyone who is involved in SJ and even others in this forum.

b) You do know that your signatures can have so many characters, so I bet after 3 trophies + one of those stupid banners with a progres bar + get firefox button + a quote from your buddy on #AGS, then you wont' be able to fit more trophies.

I think it should be an official feature of the forum instead, if that is possible. And why would the winner have to do any extra work by making a trophy?

hedgefield · Mon 17/04/2006 20:05:53

I agree. I imagine the shame itself should be enough punishment. And I don't think we should blame the trophies. They might stimulate the incentive to participate, but if you're just doing it for those, you're kind of missing the point.

Tiki · Mon 17/04/2006 20:08:07

I think that the latest winner should have a trophy (perhaps it could be part of the forum, like Edmundo suggested), and the next winner will take the trophy until the next week...

So only one person has a trophy at a time

Squinky · Mon 17/04/2006 20:09:01

He is not the first, or the last person to try and cheat on the jams. At least he didn't pull the pixelate a real picture routine.

Haddas · Mon 17/04/2006 20:10:48

Yeah, them were terrible.

buloght · Mon 17/04/2006 20:22:07

b) I agree with farlander. The winners hosting the jam can make one if they want. it shouldn't be compulsory. I like the trophies too, but i hate to see the jam become too 'serious', keep it fun. I thought the trophies would contribute to that, but i guess not for some...

So i guess, it's up to the guy/gal hosting IMO.

[edit] I think the people hosting shouldn't announce they are gonna make trophies. Let people enter for fun, I'm beginning to rethink this trophy thing too ... $:-\$

ildu · Mon 17/04/2006 20:30:28

Well, when I saw anghellic's sprite, I was quite surprised by the quality. Everything about him really pointed to him being a generic noob, and I was really shocked to see 'his' art. I was surprised to see I was wrong about him and I was happy about that. But I guess it was too good to be true.

Anyways, I don't think a punishment is in order. He'll have to go on with what he did, his reputation tarnished. Next time if he makes his own sprite, it'll probably suck, so he won't win any awards or attention anyways. On the other hand, if he makes a killer sprite of his own, I think that should be celebrated. This is an isolated incident and I don't think we should start policeing the forum in the manner of banning people from competitions. Fortunately his career as a fake was short-lived, because next time he does enter, people will be duely doubtful. So no punishment. He already created his punishment by single-handedly ruining his credibility.

I think this trophies issue is a non-issue. I don't really think it has any relevance to this incident. I think it's a nice addition to the comps and it's actually a fun way of motivating people. If it attracts a margin of fakes, then so be it. They'll eventually be found out. And I agree with you that trophies are up to the jam host.

Here's an alternative solution: Why doesn't someone create a general trophy sprites for all jams? I understand that it may not be as exciting as creating theme-based awards, but at least it wouldn't clutter up the signature areas for frequent winners. You could just have 1 x 'gold', 2 x 'silver' and so on. Or maybe this isn't a problem.

By the way, trphies for bg blitzes would be a great idea aswell.

Mordalles · Mon 17/04/2006 20:31:50

instead of making 3 trophies, just keep it to one. Ã,Â if only the winner gets a trophy, even somone like big brother will have a hard time filling his signature with trophies (unless he decided to enter more).

Anghellic · Mon 17/04/2006 20:33:11

everyone here is so fucking dumb.

A noob posts a fake picture, everyone believes the fucking dumb ass.
Then everyone starts posting pictures about some game that kid used to put my sprite on.
this is just so lame. Doesnt anyone here has a bit of brain?

Mordalles · Mon 17/04/2006 20:39:06

Quote from: Anghellic on Mon 17/04/2006 20:33:11
Doesnt anyone here has a bit of brain?

Doesn't anyone here have a bit of brain.Ã,Â

on the trophies topic.
it would be nice to have a trophy, and then you can put the number of sprite jams you won on the trophy, and the trophy can even turn colour if you've won say 3 (turns gold), and so on.

Tuomas · Mon 17/04/2006 20:40:56

I won't be liked later on. But I didn't like the idea of those silly trophys in the first place. they're fun to a certain point yes, but they really don't serve any sufficient function. I mean, of course you can add them in your signature, I would never do that, it's silly. And I wouldn't bother to do those for others. Though I might do some five for myself and add them there. I really think that treasuring them is just a waste of space and time. Yay, I drew a picture, give me new 500 pixels to fill the screen with. It's playful, but unnecessary, though I'm not saying it's supposed to be. There is already a hall of fame.

And about Aghellic cheating, are you sure he did? I read the thread again, and I wouldn't gladly believe anyone would cheat like that. And I don't see any real evidence that he did it, just some uploaded pictures by the guy who we don't know, no offence there, but I don't seek to offend the "artist" either. Unless you prove me there is such game with such monster more specific, I wouldn't trust the accusation. Yet I don't think they have nothing to do with this current issue.

To should the guy be punished, I say no, not in these conditions, if he did cheat he's bloody stupid, not giving up. But would someone really be that stupid; I find it hard to believe. It's easy to keep up a lie, but why would anyone do that. And I'm not convinced that he did cheat. I'm very suspicious though, again Anghellic, your earlier sprite wasn't nearly as good as this one, that tends to get people suspicious, no offence meant...

Should the trophies be removed, tbh I don't give a horses ass, I gave my point of view and sure people can use them, but goddamnit it's irritating to read people's comments on the trophies more than on the sprites. I reckon the trophy trend would die any day soon no matter what.

Oh, and Anghellic, I hope for your sake you're right about that...

Helm · Mon 17/04/2006 20:47:38

Tuomas, why don't you play probotector if you're sceptical. It's pretty good, Contra hack, more or less. I'm sure you'll find the sprite in question in there. I find it strange you don't believe a person would cheat so easily about something as frivolous as a spritejam. People cheat to get recognition and respect on the internet all the time, what's new about it?

Squinky · Mon 17/04/2006 20:52:12

Quote from: Anghellic on Mon 17/04/2006 20:33:11
everyone here is so fucking dumb.

A noob posts a fake picture, everyone believes the fucking dumb ass.
Then everyone starts posting pictures about some game that kid used to put my sprite on.
this is just so lame. Doesnt anyone here has a bit of brain?

You aren't good at lying.

Google Contra the alien wars, and on the third page you will see a screenshot with your stolen sprite. My understanding of google is that it takes a while (a month or so) for anything to be listed in its archive. This picture has clearly been there a good while, and you attempted to cheat and got caught.

Now stop before you have to make up the "my brother hacked my account" excuse.

Tuomas · Mon 17/04/2006 20:53:13

Well I've seen the guy being on his way of becoming a regular member, why the fuck would he then continue lying about this? It's not like it's a big deal at all if you don't make it one yourself. I mean, people cheat yes, several people have cheated in Sprite Jam, but still most won't claim it to the grave that it is their own. Bloody hell, I'll go seraching that game and see if the sprite is on it before I believe anything.

Quote from: Squinky on Mon 17/04/2006 20:52:12
Now stop before you have to make up the "my brother hacked my account" excuse.

Funny thing that. My brother uses my account all the time, though he never writes anything.

Helm · Mon 17/04/2006 20:56:33

http://www.planetemu.net/index.php?section=roms&dat=300&action=showrom&id=397677

knock yourself out.

http://www.planetharold.com/download/files/videothumbnails/Harold%20-%20Contra%20III.JPG this is the other pic on google btw. From someone unrelated to this bit of internet drama unfolding. Is he in on it, Tuomas?

Pet Terry · Mon 17/04/2006 20:59:38

If you're too lazy, you can also watch the video on this page: http://bisqwit.iki.fi/nesvideos/movies.cgi?systemid=2 It's listed as "SNES Contra 3".

Quote from: Helm on Mon 17/04/2006 20:47:38
It's pretty good, Contra hack, more or less.

Hehe. The European version was called Probotector and featured robots instead of shirtless hunks. I have always preferred Probotector over Contra! And yeah, it's pretty good. The original is one of my favourite Nes games. I still haven't managed to beat it without the notorious Konami code.

There was also a Nes port. The final boss looks a bit different in it: http://www.mobygames.com/game/nes/super-c/screenshots/gameShotId,48067/

Adamski · Mon 17/04/2006 21:01:35

Was Probotector on the Amiga? I recall playing a similar game to the screenshot in Helm's link but I can't for the life of me remember the name of the game.

Although I think it might have been something-something 2. Possibly.
The first level was all aboveground post-apocalyptic cityscape, but then it goes underground and I think sorta looks like Abuse does. I'm only telling you all this incase someone actually knows what game I'm on about so I can go play it!

Anghellic · Mon 17/04/2006 21:01:59

what a lame shit, more and more shots of a BG with not my sprite...