releasing a SCUMM-engine based AG editor?

steph · Sun 17/08/2003 20:58:22

hello, I just registered. I feel really special after having succeeded in answering all those questions.

I registered to post a thought. here it goes.

Could retro-independent-adventure-game-developers talk Lucasarts in releasing an adventure game builder based on the SCUMM engine?

About the scumm version, I would say any version since maniac mansion to monkey island 2. Simple and retro enough to be accessible to anyone.

I believe that if this tool could be available, just like a pen and paper is available to anyone (and anyone knows how to use them), independent adventure games *could* become a new popular way of expression, just like comics or indy music.

The benefits for them: very low developing costs, as it is almost totally done.

The benefits for us: cross platform! the SCUMM engine!

lucasarts quality!

(sorry if this was already talked about. I made a search and I didn't find anything on this.)

Trapezoid · Sun 17/08/2003 20:59:31

What's the point? We have AGS, it's almost as good in some areas and even better in other areas...

Privateer Puddin' · Sun 17/08/2003 21:03:46

erm, the standard of art (both background characters and music) made the lucasarts quality, i doubt the engine did, even though parts dide (iMUSE)

steph · Sun 17/08/2003 21:10:57

fast replies....

even if AGS is considered better than SCUMM (is it?), it is not and will not be available for macintosh.

btw, is it easy to build a monkey island 2 style interface for AGS?

Hobbes · Sun 17/08/2003 21:13:56

Download the MI2 interface here:

http://www.juncmodule.com/juncSource.html

m0ds · Sun 17/08/2003 21:15:34

Yes! Anything is possible!

It's almost like being drunk!

m0ds

Matt Goble · Sun 17/08/2003 22:27:59

Hi Steph,

Welcome to the AGS Forums.

The sad fact is that Lucasarts would never release SCUMM to the independant adventure developer for a variety of reasons...

1. It is their intellectual property and by releasing it would produce an absolute minefield of legal issues.

2. The software itself is probably more difficult to use than AGS, as it would be based on pure script as opposed to AGS' abstraction layer. If you live in the UK the latest Edge special covers PC Software and asks a number of developers about releasing editors for their games - while some do, other list the unsuitablity of their software for consumer use and the cost of tidying the software up for consumer use. Bear in mind this is brand new, still in development software - Lucasarts are certainly not going to go back to something from 10 years ago to release to the community.

3. Lucasarts are notoriously anti-fangame. Not only that, I remember a whole sh1tstorm being kicked up about ScummVM and how it 'infringed lucasart property'. Now this is 'merely' an emulator to play old adventure games, based on working out what Scumm did and how - Again, there's NO WAY lucasarts would release their software on a plate!

4. Sierra appear to be more lenient about such things, but do not believe that because there are now editors for SCI / AGI scripting that this was down to Sierra. Again, a group of talented individuals (Brian we salute you) reversed engine the code, while the community created tutorials and documentation.

Trust me, AGS is everything that SCUMM was and a whole lot more - for one it is still in development!

Lucasarts have pretty much abandoned the adventure game scene, and the closest they get these days seems to be bastardisation of their adventure IP.

You're right AGS is not availble for Macintosh, although can you install FreeBSD as there now appears to be a distro for that. Anyway, considering how much Apple screw over their most ardent supporters (another topic on another forum), why should people support Macs?

Hope that all helps

Matt

PS: Having read "Accidental Empires", I truly believe Steve Jobs to be a sociopath.

steph · Mon 18/08/2003 02:27:48

allright...

first of all thanks for the cool link to the interfaces templates. is it easy to change the graphics of these?

matt, that sure helped, thanks. and I didn't realized AGS is getting better and better until I discovered that now it has a windows GUI. with its development, community and ressources, I guess it's become a pretty cool editor.

still, what I had in mind was something different. AGS is still pretty complex for non-geeks, if you want a more functional GUI and more interactivity. imagine: a simple and lightweight engine, with an easy to use editor (I mean easy like photoshop, no programming required ;), available for many platforms, even online gaming maybe. it would be limited to one type of interface. but powerful enough in its interactivity to make lets day monkey island.

(and then I thought of SCUMM, but I guess that wasn't such a good idea. I didn't know SCUMM was pure scripting. somehow I imagined ron gilbert editing his games with a cool editor GUI :)

the idea is that you could build an AG without writing a single script. all that matters would be the art content: story/script, graphics/anim, audio/music. and the fact that the interface had to be the same (in terms of functionality) would make these games look like a standard. a bit like lucasarts and sierra have their own standards.

imagine a new art standard. like paintings or pop songs. adventure games.

know what I mean? oh well, just dreaming...

Scummbuddy · Mon 18/08/2003 06:53:58

when you are in your sprite editor, you can select an image, then copy it to clipboard, open up ms paint or whatever, change the image, and then copy from clipboard back into ags.

MonkeySpank · Mon 18/08/2003 14:37:02

I'm not a geek! ARR!

m0ds · Mon 18/08/2003 14:44:51

I'd say AGS is just as powerful as SCUMM, and AGS has the potential to be better.

Whats more is that AGS is free.

Even more still, you can suggest a feature to be put into AGS and within weeks it could be there to use at your disposal. You couldn't do that with SCUMM (unless of course someone took it on and added to it, blah blah).

In short, AGS is free, downloadable, and just as, if not more powerful than SCUMM was. SCUMM was powerful, thats true.

And as custard said, the only thing AGS lacks that SCUMM had was the iMUSE system.

But I can see AGS getting nearer and nearer to having some form of an iMUSE system, for example, I saw that you can place a sound on a certain frame in an animation. I'm sure there'll be a way to sync music with action too (which is what iMUSE did) in the near future.

m0ds

Trapezoid · Mon 18/08/2003 17:45:47

The main thing keeping us from doing iMuse-like effects is the fact that you can't run functions when another blocking fuction is occuring (since you'd need to check and alter the MIDI position at all times, even during blocking functions...)

m0ds · Mon 18/08/2003 17:57:19

Its bizarre. When you put something in repeatedly execute in roomedit it would repeatedly execute even when a blocking function is occuring, yet in agsedit you're right - you don't seem to be able too :/

m0ds

Trapezoid · Mon 18/08/2003 18:23:53

Really? Interesting.
We should start up a new thread in the tech forum and work out the details of a special Truly Repeatedly Execute function. I think it's been discussed before, actually. I don't see why it wouldn't work, as long as you didn't use any blocking functions during other blocking functions...

Matt Goble · Tue 19/08/2003 07:57:47

Hi Steph,

Glad to be of help. To be honest I'm not 100% on the details of SCUMM Scripting (Who is?

) but this sort of thing has always explained why AGS needed higher specs to run games (There used to be something on the main page of the AGS website).

Check out SCIStudio which has been created to produce Sierra style games with their 'version' of SCUMM - this will probably give you an idea of how complicated SCUMM would be if released.

Matt

m0ds · Tue 19/08/2003 09:05:44

Don't trust mattgoble. He didn't turn up at Mittens.

Only kidding

m0ds

Matt Goble · Wed 20/08/2003 00:05:12

Quote from: m0ds on Tue 19/08/2003 09:05:44
Don't trust mattgoble. He didn't turn up at Mittens.

Don't trust MODs - he promised Kinky Island last October with a T-Shirt on a CD, and we're still waiting!

*Matt hangs his head in shame at missing Mittens - drinks his own body weight in spirits to feel better.*

So MODs are you still organising that Adventure Developer Expo?

Matt

m0ds · Wed 20/08/2003 00:11:55

Good idea Matt. I think I'll do just that. But it'd have to be all engines.

m0ds

Privateer Puddin' · Wed 20/08/2003 08:01:58

yeh me wants! the night we watched ags demos was mad good

Totoro · Wed 27/08/2003 07:21:51

Quote from: mattgoble on Wed 20/08/2003 00:05:12
Don't trust MODs - he promised Kinky Island last October with a T-Shirt on a CD, and we're still waiting!

A T-Shirt on a CD? Do I have to print it out myself?